Edge 513

From a couple years back, this is proof that my cone IS movable... MY cone DOES look snarky in a Cozy.

The no-hump version. No possible interference. It's just in a somewhat lower pressure zone. Probably my choice.

Thanks Lynn, I thought guys put two vortex generators on purpose in front to turbulate the airstream just in front of their NACAS, just for that reason. At least that's what I heard as a response to my questioning about that. Seems guys were trying to increase the flow into their NACA's with them. My ram hump certainly is bigger than a pair of vortex gen. What do you think of the boundary layer config and hump? The jet photo? To you Aeronaughtycal engineer types who know what this is called, I apologize for murdering your professions english.

Why the hump? I like Marty Feldman..."hump., what hump?"[Young Frankenstein] Whyyy?...just because I like it. Here's my boundary layer version. Also pic included , I found that "old jet". Scoop looks pretty dang snarky there! There is a quasi-NACA design in this location that is on a DD cooling Mark IV. See the pic. I am just looking to do something that works, as a modification similar to Scott Carters dimensions, though a little smaller, [that works very well] that has my signature on it. I am using the plans belly NACA I built for the oil cooler and combustion air. These are just for DD.

For the life of me Steve I don't know what your post was about, but it said something about getting air inside, and so I am posting here. Seems there is not much posting on any canard forums, so I will post this as one of my inlet designs. I have several,but I like where this one sits. No boundary layer standoff...just a ramp to an inlet that appears from the other 540 DD cooling inlets dimensionally adequate. Its the shape of my/this proposed inlet and the ramp that I am pondering. The ramp/hump, I have seen in some old jet inlet that I cant remember. "Course we are not at those speeds. Lynn has some inlets in this low pressure zone that work very well, and are actually lower and smaller. I, and the jury are out on go or no go..but I am inclined to try this one. Flame suit on...

I would post your question on Marc's mailing list. Lots of go fasst flyer's there.

A lot of folks have that funky little swale that you found. Hmmm. My tops are dead flat end to end. Whats up with that Vert stabilizer in the background? It looks mighty skinny. [?]

Months ago when I asked Marc if he was going to do BW's on his plane, I think he said something like to much work for to little gain. So while HIS BW's would probably have a 12" radius, I dont think you'll see them occur which is too bad, as he would do a nicejob on them. I wouldnt rake the Vert stabilizer tip back any Steve. The rake angle is per plans. However you have a standad Cozy wing and mines a little different. Fussing with all the little variables that WORK is NOT a good idea. Everything interrelates. "Fixing" this...and "fixing" that is a good way to screw EVERYTHING up. I have tried to balance this, and MY BW's are based on the below. My .02 centavos. To Recap MY IO540 Cozy and how it relates to these BW's I did: I have a 8-3/8 inch longer nose, no stretch to the airframe body. Room for ballast with a longer arm. I have a 10 pound oil heater up there. Maybe a battery-we shall see. This added nose through its center body will generate slightly more lift at higher angles of attack. Standard shorter Cozy canard overall length. Located in the plans position with plans incidence. I have a one inch longer nose gear strut. I am working on added fuel in the strakes, with wet LE's and only 5 inch deep rear side baggage areas, Cozy Girrrls elbow openings. Shooting for max 33 gallons per side. Fuel will be weighted slightly more forward than plans. No center sump as in the other Cozy540's. All the above considerations, led me to add the 8" foam blocks to the outside of the plans wings . Therefore my Vert stabilizers are wider than a standard Cozy by that much. Small added carrying capacity to the main wings for the 540 CG balance. The FS for my Vert S's, Steve, appears to be about a 2.5 inch change from plans, not 4 inches. For a 0360 powered Cozy, cut the wing tips back the distance of the blend, I would think. 'Course that changes the leading edge of the Vert stab's forward as well. I am okay with it. Lets see if my plane likes it. As always, this is what I have done, for the reasons posted, and YMMV depending on all your parameters.

Well said. Nobody plans on getting fat. It just happens one bite at a time. Ask me how I know. I did change my eating habits and reduced almost 55 pounds and now with this medication I have been taking, I have gained 30 back. Age is a pain in the neck. Cant wait to get off this med. I'll sheeeesh myself... Cheers,

The 5 inches I cut off the bottom of the plans winglet was to reduce the height of the winglet/stabilizer. My 6" center BW radius is larger than Jacks 5-3/4" Eracer Extreem BW. He wanted to do that as an improvment beyond his. I just spectatored that part. Yes the radius' change as you move front to back to the TE. It opens to 13.5" Dia. [Dia, NOT radius] If anything mine should perform marginally better than his.

The guy was chuckling.. It was a not a bad thing. No slack needed. We joked together about me stopping my then current fast food eating habits. "As you eat more fast food, you move less and less fast to get it". I offered the story and BURT/Nats axiom as a tongue in cheek observation. ...sheeesh Wayne! You think I was pointing my finger at the guy and...?... Oh well.

Funny story relating to this original posts question. I have been attempting to resist, but... I title this, "If the Cockpit fits, wear it". A lot has been said about the single seat Fighter-like cockpit of the LongEze. "It fits like a glove". "You wear this plane, you dont just sit in it". "The semi-reclining cockpit snuggs around you like a Formula Race car." Welllllllll... First though. Was it Burt or Nat that made some remark about if you were too fat to fit in the front seat easily...go build yourself another airplane. I dont remember which, what or who exactly... That did however, give me cause to pause when I heard it. I weighed 245 at the time.'Course I was building a Cozy. Hmmm. Second. The story. I was watching a guy crawl out of his L.E after a flight to a fly-in once and, I remarked to him as he was attempting to shed the front cockpit as if he were a snake and it was a second skin. I mean THIS GUY was Houdini. He was a LARGE Houdini. A veritable XXXL sized Houdini. How in hades did he get IN there in the first place??? Well maybe only a doubleXL...I dunno. So I said, "Sure doesnt fit like it used too"..attempting to be lighthearted. "Ooopfhh, ahhhhhHHH, OH sh%#*T, ahhhhUghhh",and out he popped..like a cork out of a bottle up onto the strake. He grinned and said, "Man am I glad to get that clipboard outta my ass". I said "Whaaa?". Him, " Yea I gotta lose some weight. I slid down into the seat and my little clipboard with my checklists slipped offmy armrest and sideways onto my seat. I first thought no big deal, but in moving around to try and get it out, and I couldnt, I been riding with that clip thing stuck in my crack for the last 3 hours and that AINT FUN". So the moral of that is what you make of it. But if you cant maneuver your hoover in the seat well enough to retrieve your clipboard, it's time for some kinda change in the diet department. Or build a bigger plane, according to Nat or Burt or Harry Houdini.

Whats the specs on one of these..size of engine...fuel capacity...real cruise, not a salesman's promise?

We were talking just last night about his DD cooling inlets and this RR flyby came up, and if I remember correctly, that pass was at 280+mph with 59 inchesMP and 2900RPM and a 5400FPM climbout from 50 feet, leveling off at 6000 feet. The engine guy told Jack it was developing about 450HP at that point. Too bad the climbout wasnt recorded! YOW.

Steve, You set up the Vert Stabilizer winglet foam blank on top of the 8" block so that it sights -in line up- with the sightline of the long line of the front wing LE. Then you sand off the front of the 8" block so that the winglet LE and the wing LE meet. First though, the plans vert stabilizer winglet is reduced in size by cutting off the lower 4 to 6 inches. I did 5 I think. The BW airfoil isnt worked on till the front reference LE is done. See the past pic I posted. The 8x8 block is then hand contoured to the airfoil shape. You can run a hotwire saw through the middle of the blend a couple of times to section it, and check to see if your airfoil is shaping up correctly., but you are achieving a subtle blend in airfoil shape transition going from the wing airfoil form into the winglet airfoil form. Use 5min epoxy to reattach your BW together. I dont see how a template for hot wiring this complex shape could be made as it changes so dynamically. The TE swoops through what is left over in the transition from the cantilevered winglet TE and the wing LE. As Wayne is fond of saying..Clear as mud, right? BTW, As Marc has pointed out on his website and preliminary analysis, it appears Chris E's Cozy gained NO performance increase in speed from doing BW's on his wings. Chris' winglets/BW's are set back...not like these, where the LE's match. I am also not sure of his radius. His also tilt outward over 10 degrees. If one tilts their winglets outward, it will contribute some bank into yaw when using a rudder. I left my Vert stabilizers vertical. Not sure if any of that affects Chris' speed performance, especially his TE not lining up.

Jack wants to do exactly that to the surviving blended winglet from his ERacer Extreem. Anybody care to contribute a finished plans built winglet for the comparison? Yea, that's the problem. When one grabs onto a plans winglet and starts pulling on it tenetively at first, then more robustly, it feels more flexy than the BW with it current plies/construction hanging in my garage. All the force seems to concentrate down in that 90 degree transition. Not a problem. The plans Vert stabilizer/winglet is proven. This is just to say that the Area51 BW feels stronger. And Richard, you're the best, no offense intended. It should be noted that Jack has flown and tuft tested them, I have simply wanted to follow HIS success. I'll sign off now.

Richard...see the analysis on a curved beam? With all due respect...Why not just build the thing and fly it to 290 mph repeatedly and call it as you see/experience it? Thanks all. This IS the reason I posted, to get something out on the table. I have heard or seen photos of several BW's now. Those doing it are all across the board with this. People are wanting to do this change yet they are in the dark about it. There's box construction..modified 15 ply assemblies split between inside and outside with angles and 90 degree offsets thrown in. Theres ''skin-jobs'' where all the plies are on the surface with no internal structure. What ELSE will people come up with?? There's some scary stuff that hasn't flown yet. The iteration I have built have flown at the above speeds. That's where I am at with this. If I need another 5 plies in the roughly plans location top and bottom, no biggie. But the thing has FLOWN, as constructed, bed, bath and way beyond Cozy Vne. The thing is a continuation of THE WING. I can understand and get behind Marc wanting to go on record he has nothing to do with these postngs of mine. Jack too. Agreed. In fact, I am going on record with regards to no liability regarding this as a recommendation. BUT, I figured somebody SHOULD try and shed some light on it, to help the poor bounders who are scratching their heads and going off on their own on BW's. I figure since I am no structural engineer I am the guy to cat-burp out some info... So that is kinda, how I see it. Please flame me for safety's sake. It can only help out the cause. YMMV.

That's the ticket. Make the 3" troughs. Cut the L.E.'s off with a hot wire. Round the fronts and 2 ply BID shear web to start out with. Trough the back of the L.E. to allow the wireing for the tip lights/stobe. Drag a heavy string [or the wire] through and exit it at the top. Then 5 min epoxy the L.E.s back on [4 hands is good for this] and install the spar caps. 2 layers 3 inch wide spar tape to the top, then 2 @ 4 Inches down, 2 more at 6" down and the last 2 at 6" below that. Gives 8 layers of spar tape through the blend. Trough the rudder cable line and install the comm tapes and torriods. Micro the surfaces and then 2 plies UNI at the proper orientation to cover. MAMMA MIA!!! Thats a SPICY MEATBALL!!! No, actually thats a beautiful strong B.W. =) No liability for the above is expressed or implied. Quality is totally subjective to the builders ability and consistency. YMMV.

Well I think that sucx.. Sorry to hear that.

Steve, Whats your structure look like INSIDE? That's the 64,000. question. The out side is relatively doable but the inside is where it's at. Dis you cut the front off of the other one and sand out a spar cap trough on both sides to continue your spar through and UP the stabilizer? Nevermind, dont have to answer that, but it is easy to do, it makes a continuous sensible assembly that is some dang kinda STRONG!!! My friend grabbed onto my tip and yanged on it, and it was a stiff as a board. Then I grabbed onto the tip of his, and he said....whoa h=what are you doin'? I said, "i'm gonna yang on yours as hard as you yanged on mine"...and he said, "No you aint, mine aint strong enuf to take that". And you know, he's probably right, not that a vert stabilizer built per plans ever was in question, strength-wise. But the B.W. as built with the spar cap running through it is WAYYYY stronger than plans. No 15 plies needed. FWIW.

Good pics, keep themcoming. Cant get any simpler than an eyebolt. But does that get your foam interior funky? How about stress on the skins? I would put a rubber sided pan washer against the 'glass. The tie downs that Marc has on his website are pretty cool. They drop down out of the spar ends if I recall right. Nice easy design. Polish that aluminum= Classy solution.

So..... Now that all of you are basking in the the afterglow of OSH 09....smoking your cigarettes and recovering from the exquisite enjoyment... ...reports Pleeeaze!!! Fav photo's encouraged.

I can just see you cryin and pitchn' a fit in the grocery store aisle when this thought occured to you. Are you fixin' to file a formal complaint? Or just trying to be cute, and see if others wanna moan like you do? Events like this cost a ton of dough, and it's their major fund raiser. If EAA wasnt around to save our collective flyin' bacon along with AOPA, we'd be already enjoying EU modeled incredible user fees. Then you wouldnt be flying as much or at all, and you'd REALLY have something to clench you teeth about. No more crocodile tears. You OWN an airplane for cryin-out-loud...how manty people can claim that great privilege? Let Poppa P show off the P51, you have a much cooler aircraft you are flying.

Hey, youre right, I shouldnt be in this section. I'll shut the door quietly as I leave.

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