Cozylover Posted January 31, 2004 Share Posted January 31, 2004 Hi Cozy builders and flyers, I'm installing 4 brand new cylinders on my Lycoming O-235-C2A powered COZY (Experimental Canard). Strange enought the rocker valve covers are not included with the cylinders (seems to be normal). So I will use the ones from the original engine. Does anybody know if the rocker valve covers, may be "chrome plated"? I suppose car experts can do this... I know this is only an aesthetic thing... makes the engine a bit more shiny, but of course not better... Any consequencies or thoughts on the above? Cozyflyer Bjorn Quote Flying was my first love and it will be my last one! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chuckthedog Posted January 31, 2004 Share Posted January 31, 2004 I,ve have read, and been told chrome causes the clyinders to run hotter. Quote If the phone don't ring. It's me Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cozylover Posted February 1, 2004 Author Share Posted February 1, 2004 Hi Chuckthedog, Thanks for your reply... could well be true! Anybody else to confirm the above...? Also, if the rocker valve covers won't be "chromed" they will defenitively need some paint...Which paint should I use? I've seen specific "engine paint"..., but would normal paint do the job as well? Any first hand experience more than welcome! Thanks and regards, Cozyflyer Bjorn:) Quote Flying was my first love and it will be my last one! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marc Zeitlin Posted February 1, 2004 Share Posted February 1, 2004 Originally posted by Cozylover Anybody else to confirm the above...? There's "chrome" cylinders, and chrome on the rocker covers. They're two different things - I think Chuck is referring to the first. I'm no engine expert, but it's possible (and I've heard A&P's mention) that cylinders that have had the barrels chromed may run hotter during break in than unchromed cylinders, and this seems to match with what Chuck has heard. On the other hand, it's __extremely__ difficult for me to believe that any appreciable heat is dissapated through the rocker covers, and that any coating, be it paint, chrome, or anything else might have any measurable effect on CHT's. Not to mention that about 1/2 of the show planes that you see at OSH have chromed rocker covers. They look great. Quote Marc J. ZeitlinBurnside Aerospacemarc_zeitlin@alum.mit.eduwww.cozybuilders.org copyright © 2023 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spodman Posted February 1, 2004 Share Posted February 1, 2004 Probably not critical for the rocker cover, but if you aren't going to chrome them I'd use high-temperature engine paint rather than ordinary finishes. They're available here from car parts suppliers and come in dramatic colours if you are so inclined. Quote Mark Spedding - SpodmanDarraweit Guim - AustraliaCozy IV #1331 - Chapter 09www.mykitlog.com/Spodmanwww.sites.google.com/site/thespodplane/the-spodplane Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joe Patterson Posted February 1, 2004 Share Posted February 1, 2004 Powder coating.......I like Purple. Quote Joseph@TheNativeSpirit.Net I am Building a Jo-Z IV StarShip. What Do YOU Want? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Juan Rivera Posted April 16, 2005 Share Posted April 16, 2005 You can get chrome rocker covers and chrome push rod tubes and intake pipes from lycoming or you can just take yours down to the plateing shop and have them done, I even had my old style internal wrenching cylinder hold down nuts plated. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Edge 513 Posted June 24, 2009 Share Posted June 24, 2009 You can get chrome rocker covers and chrome push rod tubes and intake pipes from lycoming or you can just take yours down to the plateing shop and have them done, I even had my old style internal wrenching cylinder hold down nuts plated. A fellow builder asked me, and I just got a phone quote for chroming the valve covers for 38.00 each and the same per pushrod tube. Can the pushrod tubes be simply buffed out to a chrome-like appearance? Inquiring minds want to know.... Quote Self confessed Wingnut. Now think about it...wouldn't you rather LIVE your life, rather than watch someone else's, on Reality T.V.? Get up off that couch!!! =) Progress; Fuselage on all three, with outside and inside nearly complete. 8 inch extended nose. FHC done. Canard finished. ERacer wings done with blended winglets. IO540 starting rebuild. Mounting Spar. Starting strake ribs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
longez360 Posted June 24, 2009 Share Posted June 24, 2009 I have chrome on my engine (rocker covers and induction tubes). It's still in good shape after 150hrs or so. Would I do it again, probably not. In terms of the rocker covers, I have also read it does have an impact on increasing cylinder head temps. For heat, paint the engine black. Powdercoating the rocker covers should be explored. For finding oil leaks, perhaps lycoming grey is perhaps the best choice. Quote Cheers, Wayne Blackler IO-360 Long EZ VH-WEZ (N360WZ) Melbourne, AUSTRALIA http://v2.ez.org/feature/F0411-1/F0411-1.htm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TMann Posted June 24, 2009 Share Posted June 24, 2009 I just found a source for 'spinner' hubcaps for my mains. Do I need to be concerned with any 'Gyro' (not the sandwhich) effect while I'm retracting my gear? Quote T Mann - Loooong-EZ/20B Infinity R/G Chpts 18 Velocity/RG N951TM Mann's Airplane Factory We add rocket's to everything! 4, 5, 6, 7, 8. 9, 10, 14, 19, 20 Done Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marc Zeitlin Posted June 24, 2009 Share Posted June 24, 2009 In terms of the rocker covers, I have also read it does have an impact on increasing cylinder head temps.Can you point me to a reference? Given the minuscule amount of heat that's dissipated through the rocker covers, it's extremely hard for me to believe that the color or surface finish of the covers could have any measurable effect whatsoever on any engine temperature(s). For heat, paint the engine black.Do you have any reference for data on how engine color measurably affects CHT's or oil temps? Again, the radiative heat transfer at the temperatures at which these engines operate is a small part of the overall heat transfer, and at these low temperatures, the color of the paint is less important than the chemical composition of the paint. Again, it's difficult for me to imagine that the engine color is a large component of the determinant for engine temperature(s). For either of these issues, if the difference is a degree or two, I'd be surprised, and that's so far below the measurement accuracy as to be meaningless. But I'd be interested in being proved wrong, if any data exists. Now, if you're talking about something like exhaust pipes, which get VERY hot, I could imagine that the coating and color could make a substantial difference. But rocker covers and case? Not so much. Quote Marc J. ZeitlinBurnside Aerospacemarc_zeitlin@alum.mit.eduwww.cozybuilders.org copyright © 2023 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lynn Erickson Posted June 24, 2009 Share Posted June 24, 2009 A fellow builder asked me, and I just got a phone quote for chroming the valve covers for 38.00 each and the same per pushrod tube. Can the pushrod tubes be simply buffed out to a chrome-like appearance? Inquiring minds want to know....I would say that is cheap for the speed gain you will get. most every thing in aviation cost about $1000 for every 1 Knot increase in speed. everyone knows that if it is chrome it will go faster. Quote Evolultion Eze RG -a two place side by side-200 Knots on 200 HP. A&P / pilot for over 30 years Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Edge 513 Posted June 24, 2009 Share Posted June 24, 2009 I would say that is cheap for the speed gain you will get. most every thing in aviation cost about $1000 for every 1 Knot increase in speed. everyone knows that if it is chrome it will go faster. Very funny Lynn...wery wery funny. I refute!! A 56 chevy with chrome bumpers is not that fast!! But to ask the question again, can the pushrod tubes be polished out? Quote Self confessed Wingnut. Now think about it...wouldn't you rather LIVE your life, rather than watch someone else's, on Reality T.V.? Get up off that couch!!! =) Progress; Fuselage on all three, with outside and inside nearly complete. 8 inch extended nose. FHC done. Canard finished. ERacer wings done with blended winglets. IO540 starting rebuild. Mounting Spar. Starting strake ribs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rickh Posted June 24, 2009 Share Posted June 24, 2009 ... But to ask the question again, can the pushrod tubes be polished out? Assuming they're aluminum, and of a suitable composition, yes. Speaking as a motorcyclist, who knows "chrome won't get ya home", try these buffing products. All should be available an Manny, Moe, and Jack. Never-Dull (blue can, cotton wadding), Flitz (sometimes in a tube), and/or semichrome polish (not certain of my spelling). Doubt you'll get a chrome like shine with any of them, but they do brighten aluminum up nicely. I like Never-Dull. Rick Quote Rick Hall; MK-IV plans #1477; cozy.zggtr.org Build status: 1-7, bits of 8-9, 10, 14 done! Working on engine/prop/avionics. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
longez360 Posted June 24, 2009 Share Posted June 24, 2009 Can you point me to a reference? Given the minuscule amount of heat that's dissipated through the rocker covers, it's extremely hard for me to believe that the color or surface finish of the covers could have any measurable effect whatsoever on any engine temperature(s). Do you have any reference for data on how engine color measurably affects CHT's or oil temps? Again, the radiative heat transfer at the temperatures at which these engines operate is a small part of the overall heat transfer, and at these low temperatures, the color of the paint is less important than the chemical composition of the paint. Again, it's difficult for me to imagine that the engine color is a large component of the determinant for engine temperature(s). For either of these issues, if the difference is a degree or two, I'd be surprised, and that's so far below the measurement accuracy as to be meaningless. But I'd be interested in being proved wrong, if any data exists. Now, if you're talking about something like exhaust pipes, which get VERY hot, I could imagine that the coating and color could make a substantial difference. But rocker covers and case? Not so much. Hi Mark, I believe chroming rocker covers would have negligable effect on CHTs - I just recall reading the information at some point over the past 20 years. I recall it was in an article also describing atomisation in induction tubes with vaious coatings, and why one should not chrome (or polish smooth)fuel servo elbows (again for atomisation). It was an article on coatings specifically. I am uncertain if it was supported with qualified data from an authority on the subject, although it was reasonably comprehensive. The painting of the engine black was noted at an Oshkosh forum, listed in a CSA article and I have come across it from time to time. The effect again is unknown as I do not believe data was published with the feedback. I will keep it in the back of my mind and if I come across it, will publish the references. In retrospect, I am uncertain why one might change what lycoming prescribes without conclusive data. Quote Cheers, Wayne Blackler IO-360 Long EZ VH-WEZ (N360WZ) Melbourne, AUSTRALIA http://v2.ez.org/feature/F0411-1/F0411-1.htm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
michaelj Posted June 25, 2009 Share Posted June 25, 2009 If you decide to have them chromed make sure the shop only chromes the exterior. My AI guru has heard of chrome showing up in an oil analysis which really causes red flags to be waived. My rocker covers and induction tubes are chromed. I too am a fan of powder coating but not on the engine mount. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
longez360 Posted June 25, 2009 Share Posted June 25, 2009 If you decide to have them chromed make sure the shop only chromes the exterior. My AI guru has heard of chrome showing up in an oil analysis which really causes red flags to be waived. My rocker covers and induction tubes are chromed. I too am a fan of powder coating but not on the engine mount. That's a good point Michael. I noted my covers are also only plated on the exterior surfaces for the same reason. Engine mounts should be painted IMO. Crack detection is paramount. Quote Cheers, Wayne Blackler IO-360 Long EZ VH-WEZ (N360WZ) Melbourne, AUSTRALIA http://v2.ez.org/feature/F0411-1/F0411-1.htm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cozy Girrrl Posted June 25, 2009 Share Posted June 25, 2009 I would say that is cheap for the speed gain you will get. most every thing in aviation cost about $1000 for every 1 Knot increase in speed. everyone knows that if it is chrome it will go faster.The words out of a hot rodding friend "If it don't go, chrome it"...Chrissi Quote CG Products www.CozyGirrrl.com Cozy Mk-IV RG 13B Turbo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tyson Posted June 25, 2009 Share Posted June 25, 2009 Do you have any reference for data on how engine color measurably affects CHT's or oil temps?.... Not exactly hard data, but a simple discussion on this topic: http://www.newton.dep.anl.gov/askasci/eng99/eng99494.htm Another discussion on the topic. Of note is the issue of heat 'absorption' issues as related to engine compartment objects as they relate to paint color etc. Perhaps this is why white is a common engine mount color: http://www.sacskyranch.com/paint.htm Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marc Zeitlin Posted June 25, 2009 Share Posted June 25, 2009 Not exactly hard data, but a simple discussion on this topic: http://www.newton.dep.anl.gov/askasci/eng99/eng99494.htm Good discussion, explaining why the color of the paint is meaningless. Another discussion on the topic. Of note is the issue of heat 'absorption' issues as related to engine compartment objects as they relate to paint color etc. Perhaps this is why white is a common engine mount color: http://www.sacskyranch.com/paint.htm Another good discussion of the issue. Thanks for the pointers. Both of which support my suppositions, not surprisingly :-). Quote Marc J. ZeitlinBurnside Aerospacemarc_zeitlin@alum.mit.eduwww.cozybuilders.org copyright © 2023 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lynn Erickson Posted June 25, 2009 Share Posted June 25, 2009 Not exactly hard data, but a simple discussion on this topic: http://www.newton.dep.anl.gov/askasci/eng99/eng99494.htm Perhaps this is why white is a common engine mount color: http://www.sacskyranch.com/paint.htm white engine mounts make it easier to spot cracks. Quote Evolultion Eze RG -a two place side by side-200 Knots on 200 HP. A&P / pilot for over 30 years Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ronny Posted November 27, 2009 Share Posted November 27, 2009 Guys, Anybody have any idea how warm/hot the rocker covers get? I was actually thinking of getting them done in carbonfiber. thx Ronny Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NeilK Posted November 27, 2009 Share Posted November 27, 2009 One would have to assume worst case senerio... Lyc specs max cyc head temp at 500F. (Normal cruise at <400F) Good luck finding resins for that kind of temp. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ronny Posted December 15, 2009 Share Posted December 15, 2009 Hi Neil, That is very interesting 400F is nice and warm Have a look at this websit http://www.aeroeliservizi.it/index2.html These guys install carbon covers on O 320 engines on their helicopters. Or is it that helicopters run a lot cooler? Ronny :D :D Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NeilK Posted December 15, 2009 Share Posted December 15, 2009 Helos would run just as hot (if not hotter) as aircraft. There are some high temp resins available. They’re just not very common and not usually available to the average homebuilder. I’m reminded of a VEZ that used an automotive (or was it marine) fuel flow sensor that was made of plastic. It failed in flight and the pilot lost his life during the off-airport landing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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