Need sporty plane, which canard is best fit? (in your opinion)

[fjk]

Hello,

I've been on here for a bit researching what I can from the historical documents (viz cp etc) and while I'm pretty dialed in on other forms of sporty aircraft I've never flown any of the canard stuff.  Not averse to building, nor to purchase of existing aircraft.

I'm hoping some of you can offer your opinion as to what kind of distinguishes the various canard models one from another, and to tell me if there are things I've been ignoring that I shouldn't.  VE and LE are the only ones I've looked at closely (documentation wise - haven't seen either up close much).

Which of the canard pusher aircraft so you find most sporty in handling (vice speed or going long distances)? 

I'm leaning toward Varieze but I'm pretty ignorant as to what each type is like.   Gotta be single seat or tandem.  Just going to fly about and see the sights 3 times a week or so.

 

Thanks,

f

[Kent Ashton]

I would not call an EZ or Vari "sporty".    Sure, fun to fly but very limited on aerobatics, restricted to hard-surface runways, not planes you would want to fly in hard IFR with rain or ice.  Just good comfortable mostly VFR airplanes for going places with good speed and economy.  If you just want to fly around the local area or within 100 miles I can think of better choices:  a Zeniths, Cub, Bearhawk Patrol, Pietenpol

I would pick a Long-EZ over a Vari unless you are really hard-core about flying at the highest efficiency and lowest fuel costs.

[Jon Matcho]

I agree with everything Kent says, which makes me question my own analogies...

• VariEze = a motorcycle that's a touch too small, but still a motorcycle.
• Long-EZ = a motorcycle.
• Cozy IV = a sports car.
• Velocity = a sporty SUV.

These are relative to traditional aircraft, not aerobatic aircraft or actual racers.

The Long-EZ is the evolution of the VariEze.

[Karmutzen]

VariEze is one of three airplanes in my hangar, and like the third motorcycle in the garage (got three of those in the hangar too). Kent nailed it on limitations. I don't find it sporty or balanced in control inputs and response, but then I fly a Pitts, Extra, even a Decathlon, plus helicopters. Still fun though, and if you live on a longer runway it may be great for local flights.  It is a bit fussier than a Champ or Cub or 150, with more precise control required in takeoff and landing, and the nose wheel retract to remember, and the canopy latching, and the fuel system, and the air brake.....

Flying two-up on one with full electrical will be a challenge to the wing-loading, even more accuracy in pitch control and longer runway.

[fjk]

Hey,

Thanks much for the perspectives.  That addresses my questions.   One of the appeals of the canard pusher was the idea that with the wing aft you had a berter chance of having an unobstructed view - I suspect the canard denies you that hope.  Certainly all the low and high fixed wing aircraft I've flown have had a real problem with that.

I have significant time in helicopters and in open cockpit gyroplanes and sitting smack dab in the middle of the latter with no wings at all is extremely scenery friendly.  It is also like real slow, but that's kind of relative.  I would really like formula 1 handling in an airplane I could see out of in a turn, and was hoping the VE might qualify.

Thanks again for the responses.

f

 

[zolotiyeruki]

Yeah, I'd love to have a fast airplane with the engine and wings behind me, but there aren't many of those.  The closest I've found is Ion Aircraft, and 1) the company is getting sold off (they couldn't get into production) and 2) I don't know how fast it actually goes (there's not much detail on the site).

[A Bruce Hughes]

There were so many things you did not say in your original post......Is cost a factor? Safety?

I have 2 aircraft, a Longeze and an Ercoupe.   I'm a VERY low time pilot.   The Ercoupe, in an emergency, can be landed almost anywhere without killing yourself.   You can see more than some aircraft.   Yes it is slow.   I fly where an emergency will end in trees or downtown Olympia or the freeway or  Puget Sound or ?

The Longeze gives a good view for the pilot but almost NO view for the passenger.   Do you ever carry anyone?   They probably could not land it if YOU had a problem.   And they will not do well if there is nothing but trees or a city below.

My Longeze was bought so I could fly from Maui to Kauai to see my family; it would float if there was a problem.

 

[Jon Matcho]

@A Bruce Hughes reminds me of another I left off my list:

• ERacer = a motorcycle w/side-by-side seating
• Cozy III = a motorcycle w/side-by-side seating and travel storage

 

[fjk]

4 hours ago, zolotiyeruki said:

Yeah, I'd love to have a fast airplane with the engine and wings behind me, but there aren't many of those.  The closest I've found is Ion Aircraft, and 1) the company is getting sold off (they couldn't get into production) and 2) I don't know how fast it actually goes (there's not much detail on the site).

Hey,

Last two (I think both...) Oshkosh Ion was there and were trying to get a buyer for the project.  It is a great solution as you remark except that I was really saddened that they aimed it at the "it's easy to fly crowd" which to me is a euphemism for dumbed down.  I understand the necessity (market) but stall speed around 85MPH is no a deal breaker for me...

Otherwise it was a really nice ride (probably) as they guy said their focus was on the view - right where I live.

Regards,

f

 

[zolotiyeruki]

On 3/14/2021 at 6:59 PM, fjk said:

Hey,

Last two (I think both...) Oshkosh Ion was there and were trying to get a buyer for the project.  It is a great solution as you remark except that I was really saddened that they aimed it at the "it's easy to fly crowd" which to me is a euphemism for dumbed down.  I understand the necessity (market) but stall speed around 85MPH is no a deal breaker for me...

Otherwise it was a really nice ride (probably) as they guy said their focus was on the view - right where I live.

Wow, that's a pretty high stall speed for a conventional layout.  Any idea how much they were looking to get in a buyout?

[fjk]

3 minutes ago, zolotiyeruki said:

Wow, that's a pretty high stall speed for a conventional layout.  Any idea how much they were looking to get in a buyout?

I was perhaps unclear.  My mentioned stall speed was for a formula 1 racer I am comfortable in, not the Icon.  

I also don't know what kind of money they required, as I was not a candidate purchaser.

Regards,

f