Joe Patterson

I just did some calculations.While in a fit of rage...........Turns out in the LAST MONTH, I have read 736 new E-Mail posts from the "z" e-mail list Not to mention at least 200-300 other "Older Archived e-mails"............and no where did I find repremands for all those questions being asked, with such good Cozy Plans, to find the answers in.

I tried to figure out how many forum Posts I have read, but gave up after about 1,205

You can call me DOPEY , because I still didn't know this morning that the Nose Strut, is needed with or without the "Per-Plans Mechanical Nose Gear". hhhhmmmmmmmm

Anyway, I am at peace now.........I went to the airport today, Out on the Taos Mesa.

Taos, is a meca for For Uplifting People, I am sure a FEW OF YOU would REALLY enjoy it here.It was nice to be among friendly wierdos.

Oh, guess what..........the Cozy E-mail list went CA-POOT today, must have been the Evil Spirits. I was wondering why I didn't get any ZE-Mails today.

This first Quote below was about my Uncle, SOME HOW that part was Cut out by Mr. Z.when he "Quoted" me.

quote:

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Originally posted by Joe Patterson

....He comes across very arrogant, in the way he speaks to others simply because HE doesn't understand the complications others have.

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As for the rest of this.

............aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaahhhhhhhhhhhh

Never mind .............Not worth it.Seems like another wasted "Thread"

Originally posted by Marc Zeitlin

In the short term, it's more work. If people become educated as to the information sources available to them, then in the long term it's less work.

 

 

 

Listen - Mike is right, in a couple of senses. First, people managed to build these planes before the internet existed, and they had NO "builder support networks" other than the RAF or Nat, and maybe the quarterly paper CSA newsletter. Secondly, even if ALL you had in front of you was the plans, and nothing else, you could build a perfectly good plane, either reading ahead or just doing whatever the next paragraph said to do. I did exactly that with the Q2 I built - I talked to the factory twice, and no-one else ever during the 4 year build.

 

I'm a read-ahead kind of guy - I bought my plans in late 1994, and spent approximately 100 hours reading them and the newsletters over and over and over and over and over again before I started building. Mike is the opposite - he does what the next paragraph says, and that works for him - that's great.

 

It's not a question of "lazy". You sound to be more like me from a preparation standpoint than like Mike - if that's the case, then I just think that you haven't quite gotten your head around just how much work this project is, both from a mental and physical standpoint.

 

If nothing else, when you ask a question, TELL people that you've searched the plans / newsletters / on-line data for the information that you're asking for, so that they KNOW that you're not asking for them to do YOUR work for you - then they'll be more than happy to help out.

 

All of this goes for all the new builders out there, obviously - not just Joseph.

I can't quite get my head around..-----> {How all this by M.Z.below is less work , than a simple "YES".}

So none will think me LAZY.....I have been searching and reading for 6-8 FREAKING HOURS>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>To find this information out.(I am near tears here).........THANKS

I have three times confessed my failings....Not once I have seen anyone else say as much about themselves.

Originally posted by Marc Zeitlin

Two of the three information sources I pointed you to are paper and are sitting on your desk/table. The FAQ and archives are hardly internet searches - I gave you the URL's, all you have to do was click on them and read.

 

The answers to these questions might be interesting to others - why limit the info?

 

The questions aren't childish, they're just easily available to you without making anyone else do any work - I think part of the responsibility of mail list/forum users when on an information search is to ensure that they're not using others to do their work for them, and have at least done a cursory look at available information. I was pointing you toward useful information sources, both for your current (and future) questions.

 

Not the first time I've heard that, and I will endeavor to minimize the appearance of arrogance. I apologize, since that was not my intent.

 

The COZY plans are about the best you'll find on the market - Burt and Nat did a GREAT job. That's not to say they can't be improved - they can - but reading them through a couple of times before you start building can only help you in understanding what everything is and how it goes together. The newsletters are mostly fluff, but the "supplier" and "mandatory changes" sections are very useful.

 

Yes.

I am wanting to make sure, that what I have read I undrstand correctly.

Are both, Steve Wright & Jack Wilhelmson......Authorized Suppliers of the Cozy Mark IV Electric Nose Gear?and.....Are they the only Authorized Suppliers of such?End of question...........Please don't tell me you can't answer, because it is REALLY two questions!!!!!

Friends Indeed, Let us pretend we are fishing together.

Joe:cool:

Yeah, however..telling him to put on a hook, some bait and throw it in the water.........ISN"T teaching him anything. Seaches on the internet, drive me Insane.

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Matters of a Personal Nature

Marc, I wonder if this would have been better said to me in a private manner.

I,being new to computers,have a horrible time trying to find stuff in search engines. I will muttle through. I suppose I could read, more. I do seem to ask the first question that pops into my head. Please don't waste any more of your time reading or answering my posts, If in any way you think them childish.

I have an uncle that uses computers a lot, and has for years. He comes across very arrogant, in the way he speaks to others simply because HE doesn't understand the complications others have. I am sure it must be frustrating for him.

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I can only imagine the frustrations that others more "Unlearned in computers" (than I) must have.

I live so far up in the mountains, I can't seem to find much computer help. .............but

The information is not "That easy to Find".I don't want to speak ill of whoever writes the the newsletter,or the author and composer of the "Plans" or Peoples responces to "Posts"..........but all could be a bit more Informaive.

I found the ANSWER to ONE of my Questions.........It only took me Three and Half hours........A nose strut seems to be a piece of Fiberglass, that brackets mount to.

Thanks so much for the kindness of help,

Love Joe:(

I would have thought this thread contains the "List Of Authorized Suppliers" for Cozy Mark IV....

I want to order my Main gears, and someone said to Order the Nose strut.

1.) What is a Nose Strut?

2.) Who is the Supplier for the Electric Nose Lift?

2A.)Steve Wright & Jack WIlhelmson?

Feather-Lite....Is the Approved Supplier for the Main Gear...in Ukiah, California

John,

I second the emotion........

Perhaps we should have started a post calledn "Count Down Support".

I am putting together my first order.I will be placing it for Chapters 4-9, at the minimum. I will not PLACE the order for a week or two........... Please make any comment you think may be pertinent.

I have several questions.

First let me mention a few Modifications to take into account.

MODS:

1.) I will have a forward opening Canopy. (not per plans)

2.) I will be using custom Headrests. (not per plans)

Questions:

1.) Seat Belt & Harness Sets.....AS&S calls for Style#5,

1A.)What color are these?....

1B.)Is AS&S THE Place to Purchase these from?

2.)UNI & BID Fiberglass, It looks like the ENTIRE Plane is built with only Two types, UNI/7715 & BID/7725..(I think I would just as soon get all I need at once.)

2A.)How many Yards in a Roll? Would you buy a ROLL?

2B.)How Many Yards on a Cozy?

3.) Brakes/Cleveland...

3A.)Is this the brake to buy?

3B.)Is AS&S the place to buy them?

Any and all comments will be appreciated.

In your debt.....Joe:cool:

In the November 2003 Issue of "Sport Avition Magazine" was an article on Custom Built Panels......... The "CURVES" of the Switch Panel" is what I fell in love with.

This is the direction I would like to take my panel.

See Picture below:

Well, chit, now I gotta go and order some parts.

Here I was making excuses to keep me outa the shop, Now I got my first Pay-Pal installment/prepaid parts materials check..........

<Note to self: Be careful what you ask for>

".

John Slade wrote:

I'm not saying mine is the perfect panel by any means, just providing it as an ugly example of what can happen when reality sets in.

John,

BS>>>>>>>>That is a FANTASTIC LOOKING Panel......In No way is that UGLY

1.) Things will change, we will be prepared for this, IN FACT we will plan for this.

2.) We both prefer Analog Gauges. The basic layout will stay the same, who will be the manufacturer, is still to be determined.

3.) Normal convention is flight guages on the left, engine stuff on the right.(Note: Joe is no where near Normal, nor does he want a Normal Dream Machine) Every plane I have flown in, makes it too difficult to keep an eye on the gauges.....I hate this.

4.) I want to be able to start the plane from the right seat. I have become very comfortable flying from there. My Girl-Friend and I fly together often, and we take turns sitting on the left. No one will TOUCH the master. besides My job as PIC is too be aware of everything that goes on in my Plane..........And I am "By the Book

John Slade wrote:

ADF is becoming less and less useful. I'm not sure it deserves the weight and real estate. There are a couple of items I dont recognise.

5.) I have just began my IFR training, and do not know enough about what I will want, except I DO NOT WANT JUST THE MINIMAL. I am making sure the Space is there.

What's that below the compass?

6.) Slip indicator for the Right seat pilot. Again, My Girl-Friend-Pilot and I swap off flying from both seats. If you haven't become proficient from the Right ..I would suggest it to ALL Pilots.

7.) The switches on the left will be on a raised Panel of their own. I didn't worry with showing this "Customized Part of the Panel..........CURVES ARE SEXIER:cool:

8.) The white switches shown in the above mentioned JPG are Extra switches, Possibly booster pumps, and the space for them....Seems I read somewhere, "Run Extra Wire, and have room for extra swithes"

You have been most helpful...Thank you for taking the time to look over, and respond. And, also Thanks for being Honest.

Care for the Trees and the Earth as a THOU, instead of as an IT .....

I can't build a plane without the $$$$$$$$.........What kind of friend refuses to send money to help me get my build going?

How am I going to build the Cozy, unless someone(Sandy kinda guy) sends me some money or materials? Sure they say, "I am here to HElP You".......but

At the bottm of everyone of my posts is my e-mail. All they have to do is send me an , e-mail.....They will get my address, easy as that....Send The CHECK...............To Help The Poor.

Gonna go talk with City Of Taos HR..........at 1:00pm.......See ya at the airport.

I am going to work for the town of Taos as Airport Facilities Director,Just incase I will have no other choice, other than to come up with the MONEY myself.

Here is the view out the airport office window.

:cool:enjoy the view

I am quite glad, You found the problem in time........My responce to your post was meant in good humor as well. I hope you took it as such.

About your Cranky Problem, ...PERHAPS>>>>>>>>>IF YOU WOULD HAVE DONE MORE PLANNING BEFORE BUILDING>>>>>>>>>>>>

Groovy Hipster

I am really tired of Old Farts tellin NEWBIES how to Think, and Plan.

MIKE/DUST, say something constructive......Talk about wasting TIME & SPACE, JEEZE.......not everyone thinks like you. And Why do you insist on calling me "Rising Spirit", That is my Planes Name? And If you want me to build, send MONEY. Until I get the money, I will continue to do what I SEE TO BE IN MY BEST INTEREST. Don't make me come up there and straighten you out. <GRIN> I got special approval from NAT, to wipe the floor with you.

If you think "Reading Newbie Posts" , is a waste of your time,

Then DON'T READ THEM!!!!!!!

NOW>>>>>>>>>

I took what John Slade had to say to heart, and (even though Dusty Mike thinks it a waste of everyones time) Re-modified my Panel Layout, to use the 3.125 inch instruments. The engine instruments, I left on the top.(forgive me John)

I created a drawing of a "Panel" within the panel for the Six(6) Main Flight Instruments. I was thinking about shook-mounting them..?????........I read in some web-site post, this is done...Kind of like a Cessna.

Here is the revision of the Panel, with the 3.125 Inch Instruments. I suggest EVERYONE make their Panels Like mine.

I love you brothers, but I love my kids too, and wooped them when they needed it.

Peace out,

Joe

Hey Marc,..... Thanks for the links, good point. It is nice to know exactly what we are talking about here. Those terms do get used incorrectly often.

We know what we mean, and mean what we say, but we sometimes don't say what we mean. That sounds confusing, I know.

As for Dust.......Dust was speaking about the "Sticky Stuff Pump", when he said:

Dust Wrote:

the pumps work great, end end end end end of story

It seems that it works great.........

Be more of what you are......

Joe

I don't know how you said all that(I mean typed it) while on your knees with your head bowed and your eyes closed.

Chris,

I was asking the same question a week ago.

What should I expect when I received my plans from AC Spruce? Are blueprints included? Are there detail explanations?

First I will tell you What The physical Items will be included in the BOX.(My box was 17"W X 26"L X 5.5"D)Be careful ripping it open in the excitement, as there are a lot of Styro-Peanuts.

1.)You will receive( as John said ) two HUGE BOOKS 11" X 17". Full of Instructions, and Black & White Illustrations. The books start you off with an introduction to the Cozy, a Bill of Materials, and some Necessary reading. I kept a Highlighter in my hand so I could highlight useful Hints.

2.)You will get some "Newsletters", that have changes that need to be made. There are very few changes, I just wrote the Newsletter # down and circled the part that needs changed, Added the change(Keep the newsletters)

3.)You will get some FREE Aircraft Spruce Advertisements.

4.) A few Pages of Parts Lists for purchasing: Chapter Specific Materials, and various Kits.

5.) The Folded set of 25 full size drawings, (17.5" X 22.5"). I copied these onto "Tracing Paper" for backups and templates. I found a book of tracing paper(19" X 24") at the art store. Keeping them in a separate location.

6.)You will receive a heart felt, "GOOD LUCK" from Renee, at Aircraft Spruce.

7.) An agreement that needs to be signed and returned the Wonderful Renee .

8.)And you should expect to be up all night looking the Plans Over.

9.) And you should expect to get two or three days, before Dust, and John start wanting to see some parts made.<SMILE>

Now what you don't get in the box, You can expect to get here, and on the Cozy Mailing list...........Helpful People with a lot of advise.

Like Mr. John said, everything will fall into place, as long as you keep at it. Three weeks ago I didn't know what a strake was, or a or a Longeron. Read starting at page one,

If you haven't gone over the web-sites of a few builders, I would make a suggestion of doing it.Here are two of the many:

http://www.maddyhome.com/cozy/home

http://www.kgarden.com/cozy/

I might also suggest doing your aircraft exactly like I do mine, since I AM doing it the RIGHT WAY.

Way to go, congratulations.

Sincerely Your Peaceful Happy Hippy, In Taos..........

Joe:cool:

Hhhhhmmmmmmmmm.............Maybe I did take something the wrong way.

I guesss it seems a bit at times , that the Old Timers in the forum expect me to think and plan, and be motivated in a particular way. I seem to be looking for a way to squelch this, and can't find it.

I also seem to not be able to get across my exact "Spirit of Speak". I thought "Fatherly" was closer to what I took something as, than Condesending..............Now perhaps we have turned a "Instrument Panel Preferences" THREAD into "Computer Etiquette" THREAD, or "Computer Etiquette & Personal Syntax"

I am a jovial, Peace Lovin Hippy...........Without a way of expressing exactly what I feel, on a computer forum.

I have a grip on my perspective, and I hope John, will forgive me if I can not quite get a grip on his.

So Peace-Out, You groove Doggers.

Joe:cool: :D

John,

Do as you wish with your panel. To me the Laptop is the most versatile Instrument there is. There isn't enough real-estate there for me to put that big of a whole in it, for something I will only use every once in awhile. If you haven't already, you should talk with Al Wick, or read a bit about how he uses a Laptop computer to help with "Flight Checking" a new aircraft. You can home at the end of the day, and cross check 3D map of flight against a record of the engine monitoring system.

When I fly X-country, take the Laptop...if I am flying for practice or just around the area for sight seeing, I won't need the artificial Intelligence. That "Tractor Experience" had some benifits, I can interpret well.THEM DANG GAUGES ARE STAYING RIGHT WHERE I PUT THEM.

54..............Hhhhmmmmmmmmmm:D You are not quite old enough to be my POP. But well old enough to be My Elder, I will be more respectful of you now.

54 is as young as you make it. May the heavens open their arms and hold you and your plane in a peaceful embrace.

Joe

Had to edit..I spelled Interpret (as in Interpret gauges).....I had put interpolate.......HHHmmm.

I DID NOT take it condescending, I think it is more "Fatherly/Kind of Sweet" but I have never had a father, Maybe I don't know how to react to it, and I surely Don't need one.

I have an incredible motivation already.......A goal has been set, and will be met. How long it takes is less important to me than how good of a job I do. I only "HOPE" to get it done rather quickly.

You giving me flight time in your plane SOUNDS great, but it isn't going to keep me motivated . I do appreciate the sentiment. However that is a long way to fly, and cheer me on, and give me flight time.but if you're up to it BRING IT ON> .......There is another "Old MAN" up this way, that has offered to give me some flight time, but he might not be as easy to talk into getting his hands dirty.

And I really did want to know "How old are You"?

How are things at home?, just happened to fit into the "Hey

Watch IT" kind of category.........

As far as YOUR Home, I am still reading your evening posts about "Countdown to Takeoff, with great anticipation. A good way to finish my day............Good Luck, or,....... Good work would be closer.

I wonder, if you have second thought YOUR statement, about an aircraft(even a Cozy) being "Intelligent"?

Be Happy, I love You Brother,

Joe

Originally posted by John Slade

This aint no tractor, ol buddy. It's an "intelligent" machine moving at over 200mph.

You ought to Write sound bites for some political candidate running for office.............but I did set myself up for that one.

Originally posted by John Slade

Same logic applies to the small flight guages. You NEED to scan these quickly. Another way to consider this might be - how many airplanes do you see with small flight gauges? Are the majority of designers wrong?

Asked and answered.

Originally posted by John Slade

You seem set on the laptop. I'd suggest do some Xcountry flying with one before cutting holes in the panel for it. Scanning you're passenger's lap area isnt ideal for concentration.

Yup, Did that, The 12" screen makes a real nice X-country Moving map, w/Jeppesen I have all the charts moving weather overlay, and I have been looking "scanning" My wifes Lap area for 25 .

Originally posted by John Slade

... only item on the panel is the switch (typically central and low) and the manual backup ... If you get the double crank mechanism (recommended) this goes low on the center panel......

HHhhhhmmmm.......I couldn't tell from your pictures, where the Switch/socket was, or even what it was. It seems like your pictures are getting better.must be the practice.

Originally posted by John Slade

As for the one year flight target. How about this - To get anywhere close to this you'll need to have the bare unfinished airframe complete in six months. i.e. by the end of August '04. Hit that target, send me a picture of the assembled airplane, and I hereby promise to fly out there cheering "Go Joe" and give you some Cozy flight time.

What engine type did you say you were going to use?

Yada Yada Yada.......& blah blah blah.............Must be nice to see the light at the end of the tunnel. I guess you think addressing me this way is going to help.

As for the engine, I am looking at them all.

Originally posted by John Slade

Will that help you get you're ass in gear?

Wow.......Wonder how many people said that to you, the week after you got your plans........if they did , I guess you must have enjoyed it.....

How old are you? Is everything OK at home?

I can't say enough about how valuable the information is from you guys that have built already.

I really want to make this build happen, and it won't........unless I save every dollar possible.

I am on the low economic end of Aviation. Every mistake you guys made, and confessed , gives not only some direction to those who follow, it makes it a lot more possible for someone to follow.

Please continue, with your records. I for one, do appreciate the extra work it takes .

Thanks again,

To Kind of Quote a GREAT LEADER.....

enjoy my questions

Joe

Hey John,

Thanks for the feedback.

So the possitive news is I am ambitios............Go figure.

1.) As for the Engine gauges, coming from running tractors, and big equipment...There is nothing more important than them.....so they stay up top. I scan my gauges about four times a minute.

2.) I can see those 3.375 gauges from 10 feet away.......I don't look at them much, mostly fly eyes out the window. They (2.25 In.Gauges)also buy me much needed Panel Real-estate.

3.) Laptop, must be put away for landings. That space is just around 1 inch by 12 inches for the laptop I have now, I can decrease the 12inches down to 8 inches......but I fly GPS by laptop using Jeppesen FliteStar/FliteMap, There is no better positional Awareness than a Laptop moving Map and a beautiful co-pilot helping with it.(wouldn't leave home without it), also I will be using engine monitoring with the Laptop. There is an arm that swingsout of the Laptop compartment with the computer afixed to it, holds it in a Re-Positional Tray.

4.) Compass..In my face. I will rethink that, you have a point.

5.) CDI.........same as above..I will rethink that, but not too sure I need two on the left.

6.) Fusebox or Breakers...I am already ready to rework that, wasn't too sure already.

7.) Nose lift.Electric.Ijust need to know where it goes............The Crank is HISTORY .Thanks for the heads up on that.Do you know where there is a pic of where the Electric Nose Lift would be located?

8.) Leather Seats......i love yaman, you have good taste & style.....I have seen the pics of your seats. REALLY NICE, Of course mine will be Red and Black.Hmmmmmm or not, maybe white, and POW/Pink. WITH A BUILTIN HEATPAD.(see below)

9.) The Zeitlin Files...Mysterious sounding.....Don't leave Europe without them.

Thanks Bro,

Joe

John Slade, Way to go on the Project..You have laid your work out very nicely, It should go good for you. I have been so nmuch enjoying the reports.

Chuck,

Thanks good point (about the Nose Gear crank). I included it but I am not sure if I need it. That brings up a good question, and reminds of a few others I intended to ask.

1.) Do I need and can I install both Electric, and Manual nose lift? On the right hand side under the ADF, there I have included the electric Nose Lift. I am not sure if I can use them both or if I need to, have a manual backup. I also do not know "IF" the electric nose lift has to be in a particular spot.

2.) Should I use Leather, coverings or Vinyl, on the seats? I have considered the seat cushions, just wasn't ready to publish that picture yet. Of course When Getting IN-Out of my Cozy, You will have a towel to wipe your shoes off, first, or maybe I will have some little booties, you can sit and slip them over your shoes before Entering, "The Spaceship".

3.) What are your opinions about the "Main Six Flight Instruments"? If you will notice, I have installed 2.25 Inch Instruments. I think the 3&3/8 Inch, are too big in my Cessna, I have never looked at 2.25 but I am imagining they will be good.

Thanks again for the tip about the seats, & Nose Gear.

enjoy the fellowship

Joe

When I started looking at building a Cozy, a year ago, I had all these fanciful ideas..........About what the Instrument Panel/ Dash would look like.

I wanted to JAZZ it up a bit........a year later being a pilot and knowing more about the Instruments, I can't seem to get the "POW" i was looking for.

I would imagine that what I will do , Is: ...Put most of the "POW", in the Interior Decorating/ Custom Interior Finish......Like contrasting color & textures.

I like some of the High performance car guages used in Racing........And these are High quality............But, Mr. Slade's statement of not having that "Consistant Look", makes for a good argument.

I plan on having my Cozy in the air next within just over a year.......Not sure things are gonna change that fast.

Have you guys used www.epanelbuilder.com to do any panel discovery?

Here is my best shot so far at a panel.....

enjoying the company

cheers

Edit below:

I also intend to use what Al Wicks uses, Laptop.with Engine Equipment.