Bonding Foam

[shender1]

I was reading through my plans last night and I noticed that it specifically calls for only RAES or Saf-t poxy to be used for bonding. I plan on using MGS for my plane. What am I missing here?

 

All replies are appreciated

[rmaddy]

You're simply reading plans written before MGS became popular. The use of MGS is fully approved for the complete construction of the Cozy. I'm one of MANY builders using it.

 

Enjoy.

[shender1]

Thanks for the clarification.

[Wayne Hicks]

And when you read the part in the plans where it says to not use a starter, to handprop your engine instead, just remember that that is a carry-over from the original Vari-Eze plans. :-)

 

And don't believe the 25-hour figure either for completing the Chapter 4 bulkheads. It's another carry-over. Our bulkheads are twice as wide and we build two additional landing gear bulkheads than the Long-Ez or the Vari-Eze. 60 hours is about right.

 

There are 4 other carry-overs in the plans, but I don't remember them off the top of my head. I haven't had the first cup of coffee yet this morning....

 

...Wayne Hicks

[marbleturtle]

Hey Wayne...

 

How wide did you make your table so you could assemble the fuselage upside down on it? I like the idea of using solid core doors for a table top but I can't find ones wide enough. I guess I'll need to bond a couple together...

[Wayne Hicks]

36 inches, the standard width. The fuselage sides did hang over the edge from just aft of the instrument panel to halfway between the back of the seatback to the landing gear bulkheads. Still, a majority of the top longerons were on the table.

 

One builder went one better by simply using 2x4s installed across the tabletop, perpendicular to the table's center line. He installed them vertically, raising the fuselage high enough that he didn't need to create a space for the top of the IP to fit into.

 

...Wayne Hicks

[shender1]

Thanks for the reply Wayne. I figured that the the hand propping was a carryover from previous plans but I wasn't sure about the epoxy. It is in bold letters and I thought they were trying to keep builders from using anything other than epoxy to bond foam but I wasn't sure.

 

Sean

[Sjoslin]

Slightly off topic, but.. on the subject of Epoxy and an epoxy pump, how adjustable is the pump from Wicks or ACS? I look at the mix ratios on the MGS 335 or 285 epoxies and they do not seem to relate to the pump settings?

 

I have built my jig table, hotbox and fabric case, I'm very close to placing that first order and trying to combine as much as possible to reduce the shipping, but I keep getting snagged reading the pump vs. epoxy ratios.

 

Am I worrying for naught?

 

Thanks in advance

 

Stewart

[John Slade]

There are both adjustable and fixed pumps.

I'd recommend the fixed ratio type set for the epoxy you choose.

The epoxy ratios are given by volume and by weight. The pumps use the by volume measurements.

 

Just tell Wicks which epoxy you're using and they'll send you the right pump.

I think 335 and 285 both use the same ratio by volume, but the 285 is a slightly better epoxy and worth the difference in price, IMHO.

[Sjoslin]

Thanks John,

 

I had been planning on using the 285 mostly based upon your comments on your website. I really have appreciated all of the work you put into it. The builder websites and the mail lists and forums were the deciding factor in choosing the Cozy. There is no better support that Ihave run across for any other kit.

 

Congratulations on your sucessful flights and I hope that you don't entirely dissappear from sight on the builder forums and lists in the future!

 

Stewart

[ToddClv]

Hi,

 

I've got the plans and all the news letters for the Cozy IV but before I start ploughing my way through them does anybody know exactly where the statement regarding the approval for the use of Epoxy MGS285 is written?

 

Thanks

Todd

Wales, UK

[Jon Matcho]

Aircraft Spruce & Specialty, now the owner of the plans, has some this to say about the MGS epoxy system: http://www.aircraftspruce.com/catalog/cmpages/mgsresin.php

 

Date: Jun 10, 2004 10:47 AM

From: Nat Puffer <cozy@extremezone.com>

Subject: COZY: Re: just starting

 

Dear Builders,

I guess after Marc's last post I will have to say, "I AM NAT (DUH)!

Anyway, on the subject of epoxy resins, Newsletter #56 is still correct. RAF

uses both the West system (from Gougeon Bros) 105/209 for laminating as well

as Pro-Set 125/229, depending on what they are building. As you will note in

newsletter #56, Mike said builders might have trouble using Pro-Set because

it is so thin. It also has a longer working time, but you will note that

Pro-Set is about 33% more expensive than West 105/209, which I am sure

Scaled can afford, but most homebuilders would complain about.

According to Mr. Watson, at Gougeon Bros., Pro-Set can be post cured to a

higher Tg, which maybe the White Knight and Space Ship 1 would need, but

since we don't recommend and most builders don't post cure anyway, it would

be hard to justify the extra expense. Mr. Watson said that Pro-Set comes

with a greater variety of working times, but so does MGS 335, which wasn't

available (or we didn't know about it) when newsletter #56 was written. So

don't get excited. Nothing has changed. Stop waving red flags. We recommend

MGS 335 for laminating and West 105/205 or 206 for finishing.

The problem that existed in the Varieze days (the late 70s) was that the

Gougeon lawyers didn't want Gougeon to advertise that the 105/209 was okay

for laminating in airplanes (because they were afraid of liability), so they

said it could only be used for boats. But then when composite construction

became more popular and other companies were selling epoxies for aircraft,

the lawyers relented. The properties of West 105/209 are comparable to other

aircraft epoxies and are satisfactory for use in the Mark IV. Apparently,

the Pro-Set resins were developed at a later date, in the 90s. They are made

by the same company (Gougeon Bros) as West system resins. Let's get back to

building now.

Regards,

Nat