CAD designs and exchanging ideas.

[Super-eze]

There have been a lot of discussions about CAD software and some members have created excellent CAD drawings of various components for Canard aircraft. I’m hoping this thread will be a central location for sharing CAD drawings, discussing CAD software and the designs that have been created by them.

[Super-eze]

You can download Rhino V4 from their web site and try it for a number of saves before it becomes locked. If you want to try it I have the manuals I can send you. There are also a number of torrent sites that claim to have Rhino V4 but I do not know much about torrents. If you want the manuals just ask.

[Steven]

I'm currently seeking out CAD software to run with. Does anyone have ball park figures on the price of Solidworks (basic, intermediate & premium). A frustrating aspect of their website is that no prices are listed, you have to request a quote. I've done that and I'm told a representative will contact me within a day or two. It's now the weekend and so I won't get any replies until Monday, maybe Tuesday accounting for the fact I'm in Australia.

[Cozy Girrrl]

Steven, unless your employer is purchasing it for you be prepared for a shock

[Arbiter]

Pro/E has a good deal on Wildfire 4.0. It's about $250 and it's called WF 4.0 Personal Edition. Can't use the license for anything professional and it saves in a different format than the professional version, but it's fully functional and intuitive. From what I understand (And I am not an expert about this) is that programs like Rhino/Amapi/Maya/3D Studio Max are great for modeling, but I would not call them CAD programs... From my limited experience they lack the capability to technically define a surface very well.

What I mean by this is I don't think they are good at defining engineering stuff on drawings. They may be great at producing surfaces and solids, but I don't know if they offer mechanical analysis of tolerances, solid dimensioning/sectioning, area, moment, and material property definition etc... Again, it's been a while, but if you want a true CAD program I'd go with Pro/E, Solid Works, Catia (Boeing uses this), Unigraphics. Pro E I know starts at around $6K for the base package which does not include all the bells and whistles for the professional versions, and I think they are one of the least expensive.

 

I am in the process of designing my own airplane from the ground up (Not Long EZ derivative or anything like that) and I am using Pro/E. I want to use finite element software to do the composite analysis, and Either Star-CCM+ or ANSYS CFX for computational fluid dynamics, but each of these is $50K PER YEAR to run plus maintenance fees ($9K). It's definitely not cheap, I know I am not going to have access to these systems unless I can work a good deal, but it'd be worth it if I could . Anywho, good luck collecting CAD stuff. Hope this helps, and people can make sense of my blabbering .

 

-Chris

[Super-eze]

Chris,

 

Can an object be made in something like Rhino and then imported into a program like Solid works for analysis? Rhino is $999.00 for the full version but you can get it for $159.00 if you are a student. There is no difference in the version! I will have to check into Add-ons that porvide analysis. Would it be needed to construct a known object like a long-ez?

 

Keith.

[mak790]

Does anyone have ball park figures on the price of Solidworks (basic, intermediate & premium).

Don't remember exactly but a few years ago there was something like 6$ grand, expect something like 5-12$, you also need to know that there is no Cosmos in basic version so you won't be able to make any FEA analysis. So I would say go for Rhino. Rhino doesn't have library of parts (toolbox) like Solidworks or other engneering softwares, but there is not many standardized parts in a Cozy.

be prepared for a shock

You don't get any shock until you won't ask about Catia prices, I've heard many stories, the price for 3 modules is if I remember correctly 30.000.00$ and there are about 40-50 modules (maybe even more like 60-80) in a full version Catia P3. Marc should knows better they use Catia at Scaled.

Pro/E has a good deal on Wildfire 4.0. It's about $250 and it's called WF 4.0 Personal Edition

Chris,

The price is 368$.

here is a direct link

http://www.comsol.ch/content.php?si=317&id=58&language=en&

I understand (And I am not an expert about this) is that programs like Rhino/Amapi/Maya/3D Studio Max are great for modeling, but I would not call them CAD programs... From my limited experience they lack the capability to technically define a surface very well.

I had same opinion like you about Rhino, but I'm changing my mind, why? Check out that link which I gave in CAD drawings thread for more info (special for Orion responses). We have Rhino at Uni among softwares like Solidworks/Edge, Ideas, Catia, Femap, Abaqus etc, students usually use it for making complex surface models for flow analysis.

Can an object be made in something like Rhino and then imported into a program like Solid works for analysis?

Yes you can export it into Solidworks but i don't remember in which format, probably parasolid. Many people create complex shapes in Rhino next they export these files into softwares like, Cosmos/M, Femap etc, for Fea,CFD analysis.

 

Seb

[ColinB]

I use the Delcam CAD/CAM systems of Powermill and Powershape

 

i find it an extremly easy sytem to create surfaces and solids (and convert from one to the other)

 

sometimes i find with the large PLM softwares such as NX and catia that you spend more time learning the systems than using them and they just have so much in them that it often takes longer to do what you want

 

i think you need to know what you expect to get out of CAD and ask yourself why are you trying to achieve? what is your reason to spend so much time building an aircraft in CAD detracting from your time building

 

CAD/CAM can make the build process much quicker if your using CNC, but at the same time it can be a bit of a time waster if you then have to repeat all that work to make the physical parts by hand

[Steven]

I'm currently seeking out CAD software to run with. Does anyone have ball park figures on the price of Solidworks (basic, intermediate & premium). A frustrating aspect of their website is that no prices are listed, you have to request a quote. I've done that and I'm told a representative will contact me within a day or two. It's now the weekend and so I won't get any replies until Monday, maybe Tuesday accounting for the fact I'm in Australia.

 

Steven, unless your employer is purchasing it for you be prepared for a shock

Ok, I'll make sure I'm sitting when the email arrives......

[TMann]

Best solution I can think of ......

Enroll in a course on how to use Solidworks or the like.

You'll get the education you need to use the tool properly as well as make yourself eligible for the student discount.

 

I did this several years ago when I bought AutoCad (2D).

I bought Solidworks, I did so through my son's discount as a student. They have not offered a course yet at the tech college near me but I keep checking, In the meantime I muddle through. This has been real handy for designing full size templates (I have a plotter here at home) which is how I designed my hotwire templates for my nose, strake ribs etc. as well as full size patterns for the hatches, landing brake, gear doors, new firewall, etc.

 

I'm also using these as tools for designing the 'Blend' in the blended winglet.

 

I don't have that fancy CNC stuff, but I manage with the tools I do have and on occasion make some, like my hotwire band saw (state of the art )

 

So ..... bottom line, get the student discount and the education at the same time. It will save you both time and money.

[Cozy Girrrl]

TMan,

Acad is probably all you need for most things, all of the 3D renderings on our web site are ACAD. Its when you get into compound curves and variable radius fillets and want to generate G-code you need more exotic programs. You can tell Surfcam to drive a fillet up two instersecting surfaces, they may themselves both be compound curved, with a start radius of 1" and an end radius of 1/16". Thats very cool.

So far every bit of g-code we have generated has been done with MS-Notepad ...yeah so exotic it's easier just because if you do a lot of it then it becomes like shorthand. I'd like to see someone go edit or troubleshoot g-code generated by a high end CAM program, you can't. You have to run the code through a graphic interface to see each block then in most cases use the CAM software to generate new blocks to paste in. Learn to write the simple code and annotate heavily and you can go back and fix anything quickly.

I am still working on re-learning how to use the CAM programs we do have. I find myself designing in ACAD, exporting into somethng else. I love Rhino results but hate the interface and feel as if I have two broken arms when trying to draw anything in it, same with Surfcam. I'd get better results with a crayon. Practice practice.

Its not the program its just what you grew up with. (implying I actually grew up at some point )

[TMann]

So far every bit of g-code we have generated has been done with MS-Notepad ...yeah so exotic

You should upgrade to the new MS Visual Notepad.

[Cozy Girrrl]

You should upgrade to the new MS Visual Notepad.

You are so sick! ..but I like it

[ColinB]

TMan,

I'd like to see someone go edit or troubleshoot g-code generated by a high end CAM program, you can't. You have to run the code through a graphic interface to see each block then in most cases use the CAM software to generate new blocks to paste in. Learn to write the simple code and annotate heavily and you can go back and fix anything quickly.

Iv heard this argument before and tbh it doesn't really mean a lot

 

if you have a decent CAM system with a well setup post proccessor there is never a need a manually edit the code, and any alterations can be done in the CAM system itself very very quickly

[Cozy Girrrl]

"if you have a decent CAM system with a well setup post proccessor there is never a need a manually edit the code, and any alterations can be done in the CAM system itself very very quickly"

...thats why I keep plugging away at it

[Super-eze]

Anyone have a cad drawing of a LE or Berkut canopy(s)?

[Super-eze]

I'm also looking for a drawing of a DF IO360 LYC engine mount.

[ColinB]

I will have my canopy and engine mounts in cad soon

[Super-eze]

What style canopy are you going with?

[ColinB]

not completly sure yet

 

but it will be of the twin opening style

i think im probably going to have my own shape to suit my fuselage

[Steven]

I finally got a call from the Australian Solidworks rep earlier in the week. I apologised for wasting his time as the prices were way out of my league. He suggested Alibre.

 

I've been tinkering with Rhino, ViaCad and Power-shape-e. Really need to devote some serious time and get the basics down pat.

 

Colin, is it Power-Shape-e (free version) from Delcam that you are using?

[ColinB]

Hi, no i have the full version of delcam powershape and powermill at work

 

but i do know if you were to type powershape into the search on a torrent site such as thepiratebay you would find a copy on there also

[Super-eze]

I found Alibre confusing and I became addicted to the 4 simultaneous views in Rhino.

[Super-eze]

Still looking for a LE canopy drawing if any one has one.

[Super-eze]

Anyone have a cad drawing of a lycoming engine. No great detail needed just true dimentions. 360 would be nice.