swinn

VelocityDreamer: Your 200 knot goal sounds much like mine. I am building a Long-EZ with a friend using a 200HP IO-360 on the back and planning for a 190-200 knot cruise. We are fixed gear and quite a few mods. A berkut style fuel system utilizing an internal sump tank, modified shark shaped nose, downdraft cooling, exhaust augmentation, and more. YOu can check out our project at www.briansplane.com I haven't updated in a while because I've been too busy working on the plane.

Wayne, Thanks for the information. We may try changing the angle with washers to see if there is a change in the future. --Scott

Jon, that sounds like the plan to me. I have gotten similar feedback from several sources now that the plans thrust angle should work fine.

I am ready to install the engine mount on the Long-EZ for our 200 HP IO-360 engine. I have been told that the thrust angle should be changed to accomadate the higher power engine to reduce the down thrust on takeoff. Does anyone know if the thrust angle needs to be changed, and if so what angle should be used?

Ed, I read an article somewhere about the color of the epoxy systems. It said something about the pigment amount being variable from batch to batch. Some folks had expressed some interest in mixing based on color, but this wasn't a valid idea since the pigment wasn't constant. Colors varying from light brown to very dark almost black are normal. If you decide to buy an unfinished project, I wouldn't worry about the color of the epoxy. As far as UV damage is concerned, I don't know what the effects look like. I would think that whatever method you use to determine damage on your boat would be the same for aircraft fiberglass. After you finish going through the CP's, dont forget to go through the Central States newsletters too!

The EZ-Poxy system is a dark brown in color (It was originally called EPO-Lite I believe). That's the type that we are using on our Long EZ. The newer MGS is a more pleasant green, probably not many LongEZ built with this newer system, but plenty of Cozy. On your HP discussion, getting LESS power is never a problem, as long as the weight of the Renesis is acceptable to you the engine should work fine. It really is all of the installation details that make or break the auto conversions.

Ed, I have looked around a bit for a Vne for the LongEZ. The only one I have found online so far is 195 knots (224 mph) indicated. (NOAA research plane). I know there is a testing protocol for determining Vne that involved testing the aircraft to a certain percentage above your determiend Vne. Thats a link I'm going to need to dig up for our own testing. All of the speeds and testing protocols are things I need to find too for our upcoming testing. We are still months away, but hopefully sooner rather than later!

Ed, I'm afraid I'm no expert on Liquid cooling on aircraft. I know people have put radiators in the airstream on other designs and haven't had much luck with it. The air tends to flow around the radiator instead of through it. You need a scoop to pick up the air, an expansion area to slow it down, and a way to re-enter the output air into the airstream (speed it back up). There was a fairly long WWII article on cooling liquid cooled aircraft engines, I don't remember the source though. You might look at some of the exhaust augmentation systems that are being used on the aircooled craft. I don't see why a similar scheme couldn't be used on a liquid cooled aircraft. The exhaust augmentation uses the exhaust of the engine to create a venturi type effect that sucks air through your cooling system. This might work really well on a rotary since the exhaust exits the engine at a higher velocity than a piston engine. It might also provide some benefit of cooling the exhaust output since the cooling air mixes with the exhaust. You might look at Bill James articles on www.ez.org if you haven't already, he has a pretty extreme augmentation system (on an air cooled engine), it took me quite a while of staring at the photos to realize that the exhaust is IN the fiberglass ducting. I am thinking that on our LongEZ we will be using exhaust augmentation to help pull the air through the cooling system during ground operations. I am looking at having an exhaust system built out of stainless steel that will include a facility for augmentation, I'm not so sure about building it into the fiberglass. We also do not plan to have a 'presurrized' cowl. We will use internal plenums to maintain airflow around the cylinders & cooling areas so we get a better seal. The folks that seem to have the best success with cooling don't are not using the cowl to direct the airflow. I think it is really hard to get a good seal on it all the way around.

Ed, I have followed Johns project closely for years. I really miss his frequent updates. I like the rotary very well, there is a gentleman locally who has a 13B in his Velocity. I don't think he has flown yet. There are some LongEZ's flying with Rotarys. Mick Duckt's long EZ used to be Rotary Ducted Fan powered, but has been converted to standard rotary PSRU prop plane. A bit of information can be found at: http://www.bridgingworlds.com/DUCKT.HTM A gentleman named George Graham put a 13B in an eRacer (I believe). Some details of his insatllation are found in a back issue of Contact! magazine. The eRacer should be quite similar to the LongEZ although I have never seen one. I have not read the articles so I don't know what they contain. Look for issue #49, #62, #78 at: http://www.contactmagazine.com/backissu.html I think there should be plenty of space inside the cowling for radiators, as long as they can be mounted below the engine. After the LongEZ is done and flying I am currently thinking that my next plane will be an RV-10. I would love to have a Cozy, but the build time is very long. I'm thinking of a Renesis or some other auto conversion for it. I've already got Cozy plans, but I think they will have to wait, maybe a third plane. I really want a four place plane fairly quickly and I think I can get an RV-10 done in two years. I expect the Cozy would take me 5-7 years unless I bought a fairly complete unfinished project which is also a possibility.

Ed, Waynes plane is a work of art, I can only dream of building a plane that nice! His roll over looks like it would work really well. On the engine choice, I'm a big fan of auto conversions and engine experimenting. However I am not brave enough to experiment with them on Canard types, the landing speeds & lengths are just too high and off field landings are a big no-no. While the Lycomings have their problems at least they are known problems. The modes of failure for these engines are well understood and a proper maintenance and inspection schedule (oil analysis, 100 hr inspections, etc...) can prevent most in-flight stoppage. With conversions, most all of them are one-off installs and knowing what to look for or what to types of failures to expect is part of the problem. Eventually I plan to build a plane with a lower landing speed and a 400 foot or less landing distance to experiment with auto engines on. The 320 is a popular engine and a well built 320 can generate 160+ HP. Ours is getting the 200 HP 360 which is just a bit heavier than the 320. We are hoping for a very good climb rate.

Ed, Do you have any idea of how you want to power your LongEZ? Another thing I would like to do is to install retractable main gear. I know that retractable gear is convtroversial, but I personally like the idea of being able to retract the main gear in the event of an emergency off field landing. Doing so significantly lowers the CG of the plane on the ground since it is sliding on it's belly. I would also incorporate a better roll over protection structure than what we currently have in our plane. In the future I expect that we will definetly put in a steel roll over structure, and retracts are a possibility eventually as well. At www.ez.org under the 'older news' section you will find a link to this story: http://www.ez.org/hanson/N220EZ.htm This person survived a roll over and is selling a roll bar. There are some retractable gear available, check out www.iflyez.com for a link to someone who is currently installing some.

Thanks for the encouragement. I updated my sig and profile.

Ed, Myself and my building partner are currently somewhere in the 'last 10%' of our LongEZ. Certainly ours won't be a perfect LongEZ, but we are striving to incorporate as many speed mods and performance improvements as possible. I haven't seen a complete list, I think you'll probably need to go through the CSA newsletters. We have been through most of them, but never made a list of mods. Off the top of my head these are the things we are doing differently (note I don't say better, just our preference): Eliminated fuel tank sump bumps under strake Dual fuel tank vents (to prevent 'burping' when tanks are full) Rear seat mounted sump tank Jeffco epoxy inside of fuel tanks like Lancair All antennas are internal including GPS Electric speedbrake actuator Wilhelmson electric nosegear Aluminum instrument panel IFR capable glass cockpit Split front/rear canopies Extended nose IO-360 200HP Downdraft cooling Stand up front mounted brake master cylinders Anyhow, if you want to follow along on our progress we recently began blogging it at http://www.briansplane.com Keep us posted on your progress! --Scott

Thanks for the information Nick. Actually we are nearly ready to start fabricating the cowling. The engine mount should be here in about 3 or 4 weeks and I've already started mounting accessories. I have heard good things about downdraft cooling with shoulder scoops from several sources now. Do you have any photos you can share of your Long EZ downdraft install?

For those of you who are flying air cooled engines, I am reasearching the various cooling options for the Long-EZ. Not really intersted in the 'P-51' scoop is an option. Our Long is getting a 200HP IO 360, so we are expecting cooling to be more of a concern than usual and trying to weigh the benefits/pitfalls of each setup. The options seem to be armpit scoops, belly mounted naca scoop, or shoulder scoops. Then there is the choice of updraft or downdraft. I've heard of exhaust augmentation, but I'm not sure what that means. I have talked to the owners of two armpit scoop setups. Both of these are smaller engines, one an O-320 and the other an O-235. Both have oil cooling problems which they are still trying to work out. Both aircraft are updraft cooling. Another owner had a belly mounted NACA scoop which seemed to be working OK with his O-235. The oil cooling was reported as acceptable - this was accomplished with some extra venting in the rear of the cowl to exit the oil cooler air. I'm interested in hearing from people who are flying air cooled engines on EZ Types (Long, vari, cozy, etc...). What setup do you have and is it working? Where is your oil cooler and how are you getting air into/out of it. What type of oil cooler are you using? What temps are you seeing?

Thanks for the replies. I've got the steel bent now and have asked a few metalheads about the bending, they say it isn't a problem. The 4130 steel angle should work good. I looked at my Cozy plans to see about copying that method of mounting, but my firewall is already in place and I would have to remove/rebuild it to duplicate the cozy method of engine mounting.

Thanks for the answer. I've got a counterweighted IO-360 destined for the back my Long EZ. Figured that whatever applied to the cozy would apply equally to the Long.

Decided to replace the extrusions on the firewall on which the engine mount is placed on the Long-EZ. The previous builder had drilled several non standard holes in this extrusion for a custom engine mount scheme that I'm not comfortable with. The old pieces are now removed. I'll be using a heavier engine than was specified in the plans (360) so I'm going to put in steel angle instead of the plans specified aluminum angle. I read in a CP 86 (Oct. 1996) article that at least one person had experienced cracking of the extrusions with heavier engines hung on the aluminum. 4130 was used as a replacement. Anyhow, the only way I can find to get 4130 angle is to make it out of 4130 sheet by way of a 90 ton bending brake courtesy of the local metal shop. Does anyone know if this is an acceptable practice? Should the metal be normalized after this operation? Would I be better off to weld up some angle from two pieces of flat 4130 and then normalize it? Thoughts appreciated.

In the Cozy IV plans, chapter 23, page one, the 'Engine Selection' section talks about the recommended Lycoming engines. I am curious why there is advice against models with the '6th and 8th order counterweights'. Is there a problem with these engines that make them unsuitable for the Cozy?