The N23RR adventure begins!!!

[Marc Zeitlin]

8 hours ago, Bugstrider said:

In addition to the items listed above, are there any additional things that can be done to improve the VE's fuel system design?

Replace the weatherhead valve, if that's what's installed, with an Allen valve.

The architecture of the system is fine, for a hand-propped, gravity feed system - it's the components that were cheap and crappy.

Oh - replacing the plans fuel sight gauges with Atkinson style clear sight gauges through which one can actually see the fuel level is also pretty much a requirement, if you want to know how much fuel you have left.

Edited September 7, 2022 by Marc Zeitlin

[slk23]

11 hours ago, Bugstrider said:

In addition to the items listed above, are there any additional things that can be done to improve the VE's fuel system design?  I am currently reviewing this section in the plans I have with hopes of understanding the design better and the reason it was designed that way.  In the set of plans I have, I did read a section about adding an electric fuel pump.  I have not finished reviewing this particular section of the plans and still working through them.

Where do the plans refer to adding a fuel pump?

My understanding is that you absolutely should NOT add a fuel pump.  With the main strake tanks teed together a pump can cause an interruption in fuel supply if a fuel cap doesn't seal.  This danger was reported in the COBA (formally CSA) newsletter IIRC.

As I've said, my VariEze's fuel system is per-plans except for the addition of a flow sensor between the selector valve and the gascolator/filter.

I'm not aware of any deficiency in the VariEze's per plans fuel system except the polyurethane fuel hose recommendation.  As discussed previously that should be replaced with something more durable such as high quality automotive rubber fuel hose.  

[slk23]

3 hours ago, Marc Zeitlin said:

Replace the weatherhead valve, if that's what's installed, with an Allen valve.

The architecture of the system is fine, for a hand-propped, gravity feed system - it's the components that were cheap and crappy.

Oh - replacing the plans fuel sight gauges with Atkinson style clear sight gauges through which one can actually see the fuel level is also pretty much a requirement, if you want to know how much fuel you have left.

Agree with all points.  I'd also recommend an engine monitor with fuel flow/totalizer capability.  I use the monitor as my main fuel management resource and a mirror to periodically double-check fuel levels in the Atkinson sight gauges.

Edited September 7, 2022 by slk23

[Bugstrider]

13 hours ago, slk23 said:

Where do the plans refer to adding a fuel pump?

My understanding is that you absolutely should NOT add a fuel pump.  With the main strake tanks teed together a pump can cause an interruption in fuel supply if a fuel cap doesn't seal.  This danger was reported in the COBA (formally CSA) newsletter IIRC.

As I've said, my VariEze's fuel system is per-plans except for the addition of a flow sensor between the selector valve and the gascolator/filter.

I'm not aware of any deficiency in the VariEze's per plans fuel system except the polyurethane fuel hose recommendation.  As discussed previously that should be replaced with something more durable such as high quality automotive rubber fuel hose.  

I found the topic of an electric fuel pump on Page 8 & 9 of 37 in the section of “Step 4” “The Fuel System”. To prevent me misstating a phrase, please see the attached text for exact wording with regards to the fuel system and it’s mention of an electric pump. The pictures should be attached in the order they read, however they seem to be randomly placed on my end.🤷🏻‍♂️

Edited September 8, 2022 by Bugstrider

[Bugstrider]

14 hours ago, slk23 said:

Agree with all points.  I'd also recommend an engine monitor with fuel flow/totalizer capability.  I use the monitor as my main fuel management resource and a mirror to periodically double-check fuel levels in the Atkinson sight gauges.

Our VE appears to have the fuel flow/totalizer.  This one’s location is between the T-junction that connect each fuel tank “after” each one of the fuel filters and the fuel valve that controls the “header tank” fuel flow.  It has been labeled by the prior owner as simply “Header Tank” -  “On”(green) or “Off”.(Red).  I am still evaluation the entire fuel system to better understand its operation.

 

Edited September 8, 2022 by Bugstrider

[slk23]

Are those plans pictures from Section II A?  My Section II A is Second Edition and doesn't include anything about a pump.  Looking at the pages you included it appears that Rutan originally used a header tank near the carb?  Second Edition Section II A includes a fuselage header tank (just behind the passenger's head) but no tank on the engine side of the firewall.

 

Edited September 8, 2022 by slk23

[Marc Zeitlin]

9 hours ago, Bugstrider said:

I found the topic of an electric fuel pump on Page 8 & 9 of 37 in the section of “Step 4” “The Fuel System”.

I have copies of the 2nd edition plans from 1978 all sections, as well as the third edition POH from 1979. The verbiage you point to does not appear in any of those documents. What is the title and date of the document that has 37 pages and has this information on page 8&9? Was this from some very early CP? Or what?

I've examined numerous VE's, and none that I've ever seen or heard of, with O-200 engines, has ever had a fuel pump.

[Marc Zeitlin]

30 minutes ago, Marc Zeitlin said:

I have copies of the 2nd edition plans from 1978 all sections, as well as the third edition POH from 1979. The verbiage you point to does not appear in any of those documents.

So I THINK what you've got is a first edition Section IIA plan set. CP #11 (and the 2nd edition plans) show the fuel system that Stephen posted, and which is the fuel system in every VE out there, including yours, I'm sure. No fuel pump.

Please ensure that you have the latest copies of the plans, POH, and read through all CP's carefully, so that you don't waste other folks' time chasing down information that's easily available.

[slk23]

4 minutes ago, Marc Zeitlin said:

So I THINK what you've got is a first edition Section IIA plan set. CP #11 (and the 2nd edition plans) show the fuel system that Stephen posted, and which is the fuel system in every VE out there, including yours, I'm sure. No fuel pump.

Please ensure that you have the latest copies of the plans, POH, and read through all CP's carefully, so that you don't waste other folks' time chasing down information that's easily available.

I've just given Bugstrider access to my copies of the plans.  It's the same Google Drive folder I believe is shared with you too Marc.  

[Bugstrider]

33 minutes ago, Marc Zeitlin said:

I have copies of the 2nd edition plans from 1978 all sections, as well as the third edition POH from 1979. The verbiage you point to does not appear in any of those documents. What is the title and date of the document that has 37 pages and has this information on page 8&9? Was this from some very early CP? Or what?

I've examined numerous VE's, and none that I've ever seen or heard of, with O-200 engines, has ever had a fuel pump.

When I get home I will try to locate more information on when these plans were issued or dated.  Our VE has the header tank shown in slk23’s reply and “not” like the one shown in my picture.

The plans I have were used during the build, therefore they are in pretty rough shape.  I am still working my way through all of the CP publications to better understand all of this and the changes.

[Bugstrider]

1 hour ago, slk23 said:

Are those plans pictures from Section II A?  My Section II A is Second Edition and doesn't include anything about a pump.  Looking at the pages you included it appears that Rutan originally used a header tank near the carb?  Second Edition Section II A includes a fuselage header tank (just behind the passenger's head) but no tank on the engine side of the firewall.

 

Thank you for that. I will see what edition my plans are. I do have exactly what is shown in your diagram. I am still working my way through the CP publications to better understand what changes have been made to the original design.

 

[Bugstrider]

9 minutes ago, slk23 said:

I've just given Bugstrider access to my copies of the plans.  It's the same Google Drive folder I believe is shared with you too Marc.  

Thanks!

[Bugstrider]

Working on a solution to the different length of the input shaft between the per-plans original and the new Allen fuel valve.

[Bugstrider]

Anyone know of a way to get a hold of this publication, either on flash drive or in its original format?

I found the add posted in CP70, page-6 following the article about LE main gear melt downs.

Cheers

Trevor