jeff122670 Posted January 28, 2008 Posted January 28, 2008 has anyone in here ever given thought to designing a heads up display for experimental aircraft? i have tried several designs and i think i have a good design, but i wanted to poll the masses to see if anyone has anything thoughts on it... i am certainly open to any ideas or suggestions.... jeff jeff122670@yahoo.com Quote
emteeoh Posted January 28, 2008 Posted January 28, 2008 Indeed I have! 2 ideas: 1) The BM EFIS/1 has a VGA out, last I looked. Mount a bright panel facing up, and then mount a prism over it, and you have something pretty close to whats done in a military jet, from what I know. Ideally, you'd want to eliminate most of the colours used and go with some very simple high contrast line art for the HUD... If I can't get that out of BM, there's alot of resources on the net for making my own EFIS. I'd just rather not re-invent the wheel. 2) The eyetap (www.eyetap.org). I think the design Prof. Mann uses lacks resiliency if the computer, lcd or ccd fails, but I think that's some minor changes to fix. The eyetap opens up more possibilities for synthetic vision, I think, but having never actually used one, I have a suspicion that it only working on one eye might be disorienting in some circumstances. Quote
Aiman Posted January 28, 2008 Posted January 28, 2008 I like this idea, nice bright screen. just need more contrast and reverse the lettering: http://www.thedukes.org/rv/lcd.html Quote
TMann Posted January 28, 2008 Posted January 28, 2008 I don't know of anyone that is working on this. Some work that is going on is being done by those in the glass panel group that Al Wick started. They have written some software integrating sensors, etc, to detect and alarm (by voice) certain situations requiring the pilots attention. Now, with this in mind, what limits are there? I'm looking into incorporating voice recognition software, to trigger "speaking" updates, audible checklists, etc. There are daylight touch screens available for the panel that are the same level of quality you would find in a Dynon or the like. Check out the glass panel group list on yahoo. Quote T Mann - Loooong-EZ/20B Infinity R/G Chpts 18 Velocity/RG N951TM Mann's Airplane Factory We add rocket's to everything! 4, 5, 6, 7, 8. 9, 10, 14, 19, 20 Done
Lynn Erickson Posted January 29, 2008 Posted January 29, 2008 has anyone in here ever given thought to designing a heads up display for experimental aircraft? i have tried several designs and i think i have a good design, but i wanted to poll the masses to see if anyone has anything thoughts on it... i am certainly open to any ideas or suggestions.... jeff jeff122670@yahoo.com I know there was a couple of long eze's that had one installed. several years ago saw one at an airshow. there was someone with an ad and artical in sport aviation a while back. It was a very expensive unit. what are you going to use it for, most of the flying eze's have had the guns removed Quote Evolultion Eze RG -a two place side by side-200 Knots on 200 HP. A&P / pilot for over 30 years
jeff122670 Posted January 29, 2008 Author Posted January 29, 2008 why would you need a HUD to gun someone??? cant you emply the gun with an Iron Site?? ok, enough of the sillyness... i heard the the BM EFIS had an output...and you are right, it would be best to have a SINGLE color, line graphics like a real HUD, but i havent been able to get a company (BM, PC flight systems, Dynon, moutainscope, etc, etc) to change their displays, so it looks like we are stuck with the brown ground and blue sky. however, more familierity with the products might open more doors. i have the design down now. i plan to use an LCD screen with a halogen bulb behind it and a mirror at 45 degrees. project that through a fresnel lens or some sort of colimator to focus the image to close to infinity and then display it on a beamsplitter (you can get them from anchor optics).. anyway, that is my idea........ i would really like to use an EFIS that can plug into something like an SL30 that would allow for precision approaches to be shot fom the HUD.... anyone have any add-ons or thoughts......other than removing guns from a Long-ez..... Jeff Quote
Aiman Posted January 29, 2008 Posted January 29, 2008 i would really like to use an EFIS that can plug into something like an SL30 that would allow for precision approaches to be shot fom the HUD.... Isn't that what approach certified GPS (or ILS) and autopilot are for? I am pretty sure computers can fly better approaches than I ever could. commercial pilots have it so nice: turn final, push button, sit back and relax. Quote
JCPJCP Posted January 29, 2008 Posted January 29, 2008 Take a look at these guys for a heads up display projector. http://www.microvision.com/ JCP Quote
jeff122670 Posted January 29, 2008 Author Posted January 29, 2008 thanks, i was looking at those the other day... it solves the problem of running a halogen through an LCD panel.... the more turn-key, the better... Jeff Quote
Aiman Posted January 29, 2008 Posted January 29, 2008 I'd hit this... two times.... if it were actually a product that was out to market... http://www.microvision.com/vehicle_displays/head_up_displays.html Right now, I think the best option is OLED (organic LED) displays. One problem, they are almost impossible to find I think that a commercially produced HUD projector could be effectively reverse engineered though. Anyone have one laying around? Quote
Aiman Posted January 29, 2008 Posted January 29, 2008 So far, this is the closest that I have seen, and I am sure that I could find a superbright VGA screen instead of the dynon one he used: http://dynonavionics.com/cgi-bin/yabb2/YaBB.pl?action=dereferer;url=http://spaces.msn.com/members/variviggen/PersonalSpace.aspx?_c01_photoalbum=showdefault&_c=photoalbum CozyGrrls... since you know more than most of the rest of us combined about BMA gear... I have a couple of questions: 1. Does the BMA EFIS controller really have a VGA out? What resolution? TrueVGA 640x480 or something else, selectable perhaps? 2. If it does, is there any way to select what data is dumped out this port? (ex: art horiz, gps moving map, card compass, etc) Quote
Aiman Posted January 29, 2008 Posted January 29, 2008 EUREKA! I've found it!! http://www.planaronline.com/el/ or try http://www.tftlcdpanels.com/ Quote
jeff122670 Posted January 29, 2008 Author Posted January 29, 2008 if you guys want to put a working group together, i will be happy to host it and organize it.. feel free to use my home email: jeff122670@yahoo.com i have been working on this for QUITE a while!! Jeff Quote
TMann Posted January 29, 2008 Posted January 29, 2008 if you guys want to put a working group together.....There already is a 'working group' on the Yahoo groups. There is a lot of information there. Quote T Mann - Loooong-EZ/20B Infinity R/G Chpts 18 Velocity/RG N951TM Mann's Airplane Factory We add rocket's to everything! 4, 5, 6, 7, 8. 9, 10, 14, 19, 20 Done
jeff122670 Posted January 29, 2008 Author Posted January 29, 2008 not about heads up displays... only about glass cockpits and if you reference it you wont find anything about heads up displays... if you are referring to another group, please let us all know. Jeff Quote
TMann Posted January 29, 2008 Posted January 29, 2008 only about glass cockpits and if you reference it you wont find anything about heads up displays... Well then, start up a 'Heads-Up_display' group on Yahoo. I think that the amount of information available on Al Wick's group would be a benefit. We talked about the Planar displays months ago. I think a group dedicated to the display method would run a little thin on conversation after about ........ say, a week. Quote T Mann - Loooong-EZ/20B Infinity R/G Chpts 18 Velocity/RG N951TM Mann's Airplane Factory We add rocket's to everything! 4, 5, 6, 7, 8. 9, 10, 14, 19, 20 Done
Aiman Posted January 29, 2008 Posted January 29, 2008 My whole idea to put together an LCD VGA display or Electroluminescent display, forward facing with a mirror, then shoot that up through a beamsplitter panel for the overlay. This isn't a difficult concept, it will keep the image upright and readable without any funky manipulation of the video signal, etc. So when I was pointing you guys at the 'glass panel' stuff, i implied using the 5.5" VGA LCD, or the EL panel for the HUD. Like this: http://byfiles.storage.live.com/y1pXPUvEYKdDQpkjEHLjjeOeSmHnnlkvxngEPlYoa-Ca4WnbAiGQ6nbVirXwGlHAIBsgVVPrqOmWSg http://byfiles.storage.live.com/y1pXPUvEYKdDQpz_4WrAt0_jjDe27sjAWAVfXytDY2huG1diP8eHdh8fI_zJJEg6aWd_VCH1LQoM0E EDIT: the only thing you would need to do is run remote brightness control to the front panel, or wire up something automatic. also have a way to shut it off, and height adjust it. Quote
jeff122670 Posted January 29, 2008 Author Posted January 29, 2008 yeah, that model of HUD was done by Charlie (cant remember the last name). he uses a 80/20 beamsplitter for day and a 60/40 for night.... i would like to use a SEPARATE VGA display and be able to control the brightness myself.. however, you will notice that is a dynon and i dont think they have an output for their graphics... any word from BMA? is their output ONLY on the EFIS 1? Quote
Aiman Posted January 29, 2008 Posted January 29, 2008 I just looked at the BMA FAQ, and it runs RealTime Linux, an OS which I am VERY familiar with..... I'd need to look at the hardware, but I think something could be done. I could probably get (or could possibly already have) a VM/Development environment for whatever hardware they are using. However, I probably wouldnt 'go inside' without their blessing. VGA aux out would be optimal. Quote
aviator_edb Posted January 29, 2008 Posted January 29, 2008 How would you handle focusing the display at infinity? That's how military HUDs are setup. This lets you see the image without having to refocus your eyes. I'm not sure what the optics invovled would be but if they aren't cost prohibitive for mere mortals it might be somethgn worth considering. Quote
Aiman Posted January 29, 2008 Posted January 29, 2008 How would you handle focusing the display at infinity?. That's actually the easiest part. I'ts quite trivial. Remember, you are looking through the image, which is being rendered further away than it appears.. Bonus points to the person who can say the lens that would do it, and where it should be placed in the optical path . Quote
jeff122670 Posted January 29, 2008 Author Posted January 29, 2008 i was initially thinking a Fresnel lens after the 45 degree bend... however, i read something about a colimator (spell) that does this for you... i havent been able to find the type of lens that would do it, but i was thinking you might be able to use a lens system from a slide projector or something.... help the "optically challenged"...... Jeff Quote
Aiman Posted January 30, 2008 Posted January 30, 2008 A fresnel lens can actually be part of a collimator assembly. and yes, you are exactly right. you would probably put it in the light path just near the primary reflector I think that I am going to get building a test box to test with an LCD this weekend. Example: http://www.mikesflightdeck.com/head_up_displays.htm EDIT: Much more detailed information, which also addresses stereoscopic and portal effect errors introduced by infinity focus http://books.google.com/books?id=rbKkojYNjecC&pg=RA1-PA25&lpg=RA1-PA25&dq=collimating+lens+system+hud&source=web&ots=PYEuJI2lqG&sig=3XWLn-x0brBHdfgBJcXjmbL0_-M#PRA1-PA37,M1 Quote
aviator_edb Posted January 30, 2008 Posted January 30, 2008 Wow, ok. How do you put these optics together? Where would you buy them or scavenge them from ? What do I google on! AGRGH, now you've peaked my interest. Darnit! Wait, aren't Fresnel lenses what are used in lighthouses? Crap, I know just enough to know I dont know squat about optics.. Quote
aviator_edb Posted January 30, 2008 Posted January 30, 2008 Ok, I'm so bored so I did a little digging...I found this place: http://www.fresneltech.com they sell a bunch of different frensel lenses and the prices seem pretty cheap. However, I have no clue if what they sell is even remotely usefull for this application... Quote
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.