chuckthedog Posted May 7, 2003 Share Posted May 7, 2003 I have found a way to stay warm in my plane after years of freezing my A$% off. I tried the 12 volt hair dryer. A joke! I will not run hot engine oil up with me. What I have come up with is a pair of socks and Jacket made by Gerbings for Motor Cycle riders. The gloves and pants are not needed, but they got them too. They hook up to your Batt. and have a 10 amp fuse in line to a reostat then you just plug yourself in and stay warm! You can see there stuff at www.gerbing.com Living in the northern US and flying high. I know you will like this. The jacket looks cool, and you can walk with the socks in your shoes. Quote If the phone don't ring. It's me Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aaron Posted May 7, 2003 Share Posted May 7, 2003 10 amp fuse? That some serious heating! Was the 10 amp taken from product specs or was it a guesstimate? Don't get me wrong, I'm sure it works fine, I'm just curious what the real current draw is. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chuckthedog Posted May 7, 2003 Author Share Posted May 7, 2003 Aaron, Gerbing says the jacket at full power will draw 77 watts or 6 amps the socks are 22 watts or 2.28 amps. I can tell you you will turn it down a lot after a short time. These guys have been in the business sence WWII B-17s and stuff. These are made for MC. IE small alt. and batt. I know you won't need this for many years. Just go to the Gerbins web site. I can tell you I have used them for the last two winters full time and over 8000 feet almost all the time (jacket only in the summer) and they work! Everything is all set up just bolt to Batt. posts. Quote If the phone don't ring. It's me Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dust Posted May 7, 2003 Share Posted May 7, 2003 Do you have those big holes where the aileron tubes come thru the fuselodge, before the offsets were invented? Quote maker wood dust and shavings - foam and fiberglass dust and one day a cozy will pop out, enjoying the build i can be reached at http://www.canardcommunity.com/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chuckthedog Posted May 7, 2003 Author Share Posted May 7, 2003 no Quote If the phone don't ring. It's me Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chuckthedog Posted May 7, 2003 Author Share Posted May 7, 2003 Dust, A good friend of mine who passed away was from Northville, Novi area and knew about all the pickel fork drivers down in that neck of the woods. I was wondering if you knew him also. His name was Rex Rexin. He started his Long project in my hanger in 1982 and we built 2 of every thing.In 1990 I through him out of my hanger cause he had built his own. and I started flying my half of the parts. I don't remember ever seeing those big holes you are talking about. Did I miss a page in the plans? Quote If the phone don't ring. It's me Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dust Posted May 7, 2003 Share Posted May 7, 2003 Jim price has a long (my tech advisor) and the holes for his torque tubes are larger than the tube because of the arc they travel through. I noticed them because he was trying to seal them better when I saw his plane last. He said the offset control part that allowed the hole to be shrunk was a later improvement. He said that hole was a major reason that longs were cold. After that we made a complete two part cover for the landing gear area to stop all air infiltration. Sorry to have never met Rex Rexin. Quote maker wood dust and shavings - foam and fiberglass dust and one day a cozy will pop out, enjoying the build i can be reached at http://www.canardcommunity.com/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chuckthedog Posted May 7, 2003 Author Share Posted May 7, 2003 Mike, Rex knew Jim, and I met him a long time ago. After you get the holes closed it dose help , but just sitting and not being able to move around you do get cold. No sun light is the worst. I like the Gerbings cause no moving parts, no weight. (unless you fly naked) and no heavy boots to keep your feet warm. I like to fly in my tennies, or bare foot. I'm a Jack Pine savage at hart. The other thing to remember. even on a hot day when you get around 10k it gets a little cool. Quote If the phone don't ring. It's me Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dust Posted May 7, 2003 Share Posted May 7, 2003 Understand, am putting a turboe in my cozy and will go high as freezing heck, so comments on cold go right to my feet and hands. Quote maker wood dust and shavings - foam and fiberglass dust and one day a cozy will pop out, enjoying the build i can be reached at http://www.canardcommunity.com/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LargePrime Posted May 9, 2003 Share Posted May 9, 2003 How hard is it too keep warm in a cozy relative to, say, spam cans. It would seem that fiberglass foam would be much warmer than aluminium, but i have read many reports about how cold it can get. Is the real source of these discussions that cozy's fly higher? Or is it that there are holes (that can be plugged)? Will the standard cabin heat not do at altitude? If this is hijacking a thread then feel free to do as you see fit with it. Quote We know who you are... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Slade Posted May 9, 2003 Share Posted May 9, 2003 I'm hoping that my hot water powered automotive heater will do the job nicely. Yet another good reason for using a 13B! Quote I can be reached on the "other" forum http://canardaviationforum.dmt.net Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chuckthedog Posted May 9, 2003 Author Share Posted May 9, 2003 This is the way I see it. First if you stay low,south, and in the sun. you should not have a problem. If you instal the plans type. Hot air off the exhaust muff and get a crack under the heat muff you could gas yourself. They don't work too good. If you run hot engine oil through a radiator up front and spring a leak in the cabin. You have a mess and an engine that is gonna need oil fast. It also weighs more. As for the hot water. You will have one more place to spring a leak. It also will have added weight. With the electric jacket and socks. You have no moving parts. You probably are going to take a jacket anyway and most people ware socks. So no added weight. No hot oil or water bath. no bad gas. Now the fan. with hot air,oil,water, you still need to run a fan. the jacket and socks dont need a fan. so no electric moter radiation into the radio. That is why I use the electric clothes. One more thing to think about. The cloths cost less than the other systems. Quote If the phone don't ring. It's me Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Slade Posted May 9, 2003 Share Posted May 9, 2003 The cloths cost less than the other systems True, but as you say - you can't fly naked with this system. John Slade Member AANR http://aanr.com/ Quote I can be reached on the "other" forum http://canardaviationforum.dmt.net Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aaron Posted May 9, 2003 Share Posted May 9, 2003 Reminds me of some fun I had driving back from college. my car had a tendency to overheat, so I'm driving through Arizona at 110F all the windows down and the heat turned on high. When the heater core blew, water and glycol coated the inside of my windsheild, while my legs were being scalded. Luckily I was able to put my head out the window so I could continue to see the road. Make sure that heater installation of yours is bulletproof, John. It might just decide to go on you when you're on final, and that could really ruin your day especially if you and char fly naked. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
marbleturtle Posted May 9, 2003 Share Posted May 9, 2003 Put on some clothes you freaky hippie! How do you defog/defrost the bubble without heat? Quote This ain't rocket surgery! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chuckthedog Posted May 10, 2003 Author Share Posted May 10, 2003 I have a NACA scoop just in front of the canopy with a butterfly valve. it gose from off to blowing a stream of air along the inside of the canopy. work good. like wear a Took A. PS Gerbings makes one of them too. Quote If the phone don't ring. It's me Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Slade Posted May 10, 2003 Share Posted May 10, 2003 It may not be literally bulletproof, but its plumbed with aircraft grade alimunum and AN fittings, and I have a cut off valve within easy reach. I have closable NACA scoops on each side and hot air vents around the front of the canopy. Only concern I have about flying naked is engine failure over a major airport. Quote I can be reached on the "other" forum http://canardaviationforum.dmt.net Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chuckthedog Posted May 10, 2003 Author Share Posted May 10, 2003 What about the fan motor yumm in the radio? What about the weight of the system? what about the time to design,install,and the CO$T? is there a replacement guarantee? What ya gonna wear when you get some place and have to fuel up? A wind breaker and a pair of socks? Can you buy antifreeze at the FBO? Is there another set of valves buy the engine, to keep all that hot pipe from messen up the PVC foam under the Hi temp epoxy? Quote If the phone don't ring. It's me Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Slade Posted May 10, 2003 Share Posted May 10, 2003 >What about the fan motor yumm in the radio? Doesn't seem to make any difference. >What about the weight of the system? 35lbs inc. the AC compressor and condenser. >what about the time to design,install,and the CO$T? maybe 6 weeks altogether. Cost - $75 from a breakers yard. >is there a replacement guarantee? Yep. Costs $75. >What ya gonna wear when you get some place and have to fuel up? Didn't I mention my air-to-air refueling pod. >Can you buy antifreeze at the FBO? Nope. How often do you put antifreeze in you're car? >pipe from messen up the PVC foam under the Hi temp epoxy? The pipes go through the heat duct and are insulated all the way. Hey. Maybe it won't work - maybe it will. Someones gotta make the first air-conditioned Cozy. It might as well be me. Like I read on someones by-line recently - if we knew what we were doing, they wouldnt call it experimental. Quote I can be reached on the "other" forum http://canardaviationforum.dmt.net Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chuckthedog Posted May 10, 2003 Author Share Posted May 10, 2003 You are right on the money about experimentation. The same reason I chose the electric wind breaker, and socks. It was a case of trial and error. I'm shure Rutans heating system worked great in Mojave. I spent the first 10 years of flying my Experimental using the old flyin rule of thumb. Wear the clothes you will need to stay alive if you have a forced landing in the wild. Before my Long I flew old Tail draggers mostly. For close to 20 years. They also have little or no heat in the creacher cage. Wish they had electrical system in them, and knew then what I know now. I now live in the tropics of Central Indiana. You don't even have to wear a coat all the time as early as the middle of May. through September. I still stuff my Gerbings wind breaker in the strake. Just incase. If you are still readig this John,I have one more piece of trial and error experimentation to pass on. The fan noise in the radio. When I instaled my electric belly board. I found I can hear it extend through my head set. I can hear the strong trim motor in the head set. It dose not run much. no problem. For some reason the EZ Nose Lift dose not do it. I don't know why. It is with this knowledge I assume the heater fan will buzz through the radio. Build hard. Fly hard. Stay hard. Quote If the phone don't ring. It's me Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dust Posted May 11, 2003 Share Posted May 11, 2003 I've heard that the longs sere cold and the cozy's weren't. Did you install a heating system? Quote maker wood dust and shavings - foam and fiberglass dust and one day a cozy will pop out, enjoying the build i can be reached at http://www.canardcommunity.com/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chuckthedog Posted May 11, 2003 Author Share Posted May 11, 2003 Yes I did. Then I tried the 12 volt electric heater. Then tried the clothes for one winter. Then took out the Rutan system and the 12 volt system. when it is real cold up north you get the best flying weather. Calm winds, blue skys, and thick air. I also take those chemical heat pads used for ice fishing. I tape one around the stick to keep my right hand warm. They work for up to 4 hours them you throw them away. Quote If the phone don't ring. It's me Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dust Posted May 15, 2003 Share Posted May 15, 2003 I like advice and i normally take it, chuckthedog, but in this instance, i can't. For 2 reasons, 1 - I will fly up to 25000 or so with the turbo and two, my wife. If i tell her to plug herself in she won't be happy, she has kept me over 33 years and I know the result on not happy. But I am listening. As soon as the planes are lifted I am going to more than double the tube for the heat. I will then increase the size of the heat muff substancially and probably use one of those extra naca scoops i am putting in the turtledeck for direct air preasure. Other considerations will probably include pump up seal for the canopy, more latches, and up front controllable exit air vents for wayne's air out flo comment. So i will increase hot air volume Increase preasure with no blower (maybe) Regulate exit air Increase air temperature Superseal all else Quote maker wood dust and shavings - foam and fiberglass dust and one day a cozy will pop out, enjoying the build i can be reached at http://www.canardcommunity.com/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Slade Posted May 15, 2003 Share Posted May 15, 2003 At 25,000 or so, you'd better have room for a LARGE Ox bottle for two, too. Better yet - have one each for redundancy. Quote I can be reached on the "other" forum http://canardaviationforum.dmt.net Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dust Posted May 16, 2003 Share Posted May 16, 2003 kevlar in the strake with an oximeter. Have found out today that you are probable the smartest here for your heat system. Barons have a gas heater. I may still have to plug in! Quote maker wood dust and shavings - foam and fiberglass dust and one day a cozy will pop out, enjoying the build i can be reached at http://www.canardcommunity.com/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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