What is the best type of RG

[SAF_Zoom]

Hi guys I'm new around here.

 

I'm seriously thinking of acquiring a Long EZ (or building one) in the very near futur.

 

My question is what is the best retractable main and front wheel system available on the market. Not a question on best bang for the buck... but which are the best... period...

 

Your input is very appreciated,

 

As a side note, as anybody ever saw a EZ using a "Harrier Jet" or "Glider Type" undercarriage... To illustrate... you would have a single gear in front, One aft of the CG and two small retract gear at both wing tips (who only tilt backward into the airstream)... Could be a cool desing. But I doubt there is space for a gear to retract internally in the belly of the EZ... What do you guys thinks....

 

Regards,

[Drew Swenson]

I believe that a Harrier design incorporates this to keep the hot exhaust off the tires. So why would you think it would be cool to incorporate this into a design? What effect are you trying to achieve?

 

Sticking with the plans is the fastest way to finish---modifications are very time consuming.

[mfryer]

Having the main gear just in front of the prop might not be the best idea. The landing brake can offer some protection from things the nose gear might kick up, but a main gear in the center could throw debris right into the prop.

 

Interesting thought though.

[TMann]

I have an opinion as to what I think is the best RG for this plane but rather than re-open this debate, I would rather see you take some steps towards building your plane. I don't see where you have purchase the plans (Terf-CD) bought any material or done any of the preparation towards starting your build(such as building a construction table, fabric cabinet, etc.) I'm afraid you have fallen into a group of serious builders who will only continue to offer up advice and tips to those who show commitment to a project but will not suffer the 'blue sky' class of questions for very long.

 

You need to start studying a set of REAL plans. This will help you weed out the questions that will not fit the plane. Get started.

[SAF_Zoom]

I believe that a Harrier design incorporates this to keep the hot exhaust off the tires. So why would you think it would be cool to incorporate this into a design? What effect are you trying to achieve?

 

Sticking with the plans is the fastest way to finish---modifications are very time consuming.

This was meant more for fun then to actually include this in as a design mod... I'm looking for off the counter stuff...

[SAF_Zoom]

I have an opinion as to what I think is the best RG for this plane but rather than re-open this debate, I would rather see you take some steps towards building your plane. I don't see where you have purchase the plans (Terf-CD) bought any material or done any of the preparation towards starting your build(such as building a construction table, fabric cabinet, etc.) I'm afraid you have fallen into a group of serious builders who will only continue to offer up advice and tips to those who show commitment to a project but will not suffer the 'blue sky' class of questions for very long.

 

You need to start studying a set of REAL plans. This will help you weed out the questions that will not fit the plane. Get started.

And why should I do all of that if I end up buying a completed aircraft ???

 

But for your info I'm already signed up at CSA (with present at past issues in the mail) and EAA... As for the Terf CD... I will be buying this soon enought as the price is well insignificant...

 

Contrary to you I beleive in asking around before I loose any time over something. Why should I spend a significant amount of time reading countless threads were many who post have no actual first hand knowledge...

 

My question is simple... in order to plan this project (either buying or building) what is the best (meaning most reliable) retractable front and main gear system out there. And I would like to ear from poeple that actually have these system in theit plane. Poeple that are actually using them in the feild.

[Cozy Girrrl]

What is the best type of RG?

 

The type that is welded down

[TMann]

What is the best type of RG?

 

The type that is welded down

....... took the words right out of my mouth.

 

Good luck finding a Long-EZ or Cozy with retracts if you are buying pre-built.

I don't know if you can buy the 'best' at this time.

I have a set on order, but that is because I was willing to take some risk and put my money where my mouth was.

 

Many of the sets that were available are no longer.

I know Lynn prefers the type that pivots at the fuselage.

I prefer the type that pivots at the outboard end of the center section spar.

 

There is plenty of information on the forums (and much heated discussion on the subject) if you do some searching.

[Lynn Erickson]

What is the best type of RG?

 

The type that is welded down

I'll second that. the best type is the ones that don't retract and you put on wheel pants to reduce drag.

[Lynn Erickson]

....... took the words right out of my mouth.

 

Good luck finding a Long-EZ or Cozy with retracts if you are buying pre-built.

I don't know if you can buy the 'best' at this time.

I have a set on order, but that is because I was willing to take some risk and put my money where my mouth was.

 

Many of the sets that were available are no longer.

I know Lynn prefers the type that pivots at the fuselage.

I prefer the type that pivots at the outboard end of the center section spar.

 

There is plenty of information on the forums (and much heated discussion on the subject) if you do some searching.

actually I don;t care where the pivots are but if I have to fly with retracts I prefer the ones the do come down when you need them and don't self destruct during landing.

[TMann]

actually I don;t care where the pivots are but if I have to fly with retracts I prefer the ones the do come down when you need them and don't self destruct during landing.

Hence the text in post #4

I have an opinion as to what I think is the best RG for this plane but rather than re-open this debate.........

Ohhhhhhh I could go on and on ........... but I'll leave the rant for others.

[TMann]

Hey ...... Here's some good gear!

http://www.iflyez.com/video/Infinity_Gear_Retracts.wmv

 

I'm bad!

[Vacabrava]

Nice work TMann,

19 seconds to retract and 18 seconds to extend.

Like C130.

[TMann]

Nice work TMann,

 

19 seconds to retract and 18 seconds to extend.

 

Like C130.

 

Actually these are installed on Waiter's Long-EZ. (credit where credit is due)

I have the same pair on order.

 

Some folks don't like them:

• They are attached to the spar vs. the fuselage.
• The gear legs don't hold up as well when you wrap a chain around them to pull your plane out of a pond.
• The gear also does not hold up well when you land in a ditch.
• .......and lastly, the delivery takes a long time.

Check out more on Waiter's site: www.iflyez.com

He's done the best job I've seen on documenting the installation.

[Lifessamsara]

SAF, you may like to look at this link:

 

 

This is a similar design to Lynn's but in a LEz (Rick Pellicciotti ). This design in a LEz was done by the late Steve Drybread.

 

I believe Velocity Aircraft guys may sell off the shelf system components, but would require adaption into a LEz. Lynn, any thoughts on this 'off the shelf' approach?

 

Cozy Girrrrls, I sense you have also been interested in this product in the past couple of years (spotted inspecting Rick's LEz in detail at RR last year???)

 

Bruce.

[TMann]

Cozy Girrrrls, I sense you have also been interested in this product in the past couple of years (spotted inspecting Rick's LEz in detail at RR last year???)

 

Bruce.

The Cozy Girrrls, Waiter and I are all using the retracts from Infinity Aerospace.

[SAF_Zoom]

....... took the words right out of my mouth.

 

Good luck finding a Long-EZ or Cozy with retracts if you are buying pre-built.

I don't know if you can buy the 'best' at this time.

I have a set on order, but that is because I was willing to take some risk and put my money where my mouth was.

 

Many of the sets that were available are no longer.

I know Lynn prefers the type that pivots at the fuselage.

I prefer the type that pivots at the outboard end of the center section spar.

 

There is plenty of information on the forums (and much heated discussion on the subject) if you do some searching.

Well I know what type you will be installing (read that on another forum)... not sure they are the BEST though...

[SAF_Zoom]

actually I don;t care where the pivots are but if I have to fly with retracts I prefer the ones the do come down when you need them and don't self destruct during landing.

Thanks Lynn read all of your post (and Tmann's) post regarding the Infinity gears....

 

This is why I'm asking questions like these... to get both side of the coin...

 

But hey being an ex-aircraft technician and working on crashed engines (when I worked at P&W)... well lets just say I tend to approach safety concern with a great deal of attention...

[SAF_Zoom]

SAF, you may like to look at this link:

 

 

This is a similar design to Lynn's but in a LEz (Rick Pellicciotti ). This design in a LEz was done by the late Steve Drybread.

 

I believe Velocity Aircraft guys may sell off the shelf system components, but would require adaption into a LEz. Lynn, any thoughts on this 'off the shelf' approach?

 

Cozy Girrrrls, I sense you have also been interested in this product in the past couple of years (spotted inspecting Rick's LEz in detail at RR last year???)

 

Bruce.

Actually this is the type I prefer. Less risk of failure. The design is very simple. Their is no need to compress the gear before retract (on a LE). The system can be made to be electricly actuated.

 

Just safer and better..

[TMann]

Actually this is the type I prefer. Less risk of failure. The design is very simple. Their is no need to compress the gear before retract (on a LE). The system can be made to be electricly actuated.

 

Just safer and better..

Real planes use oleo struts.

Make sure you have a back-up electrical system.

The hydaulic system holds the gear up on the Infinity system. It is not required to deploy the gear.

I guess Steve H, Waiter, Cozy Girrrls and I have it wrong. Oh well..... too late for me to change now.

[JTest]

G'day

 

I am at a loss understanding SAF_Zoom. SAF_Zoom is fairly new (10 days) and has by his own admission had at least one crazy (or more) idea in this forum.

 

Mark Twain said it best; "Action speaks louder than words but not nearly as often."

 

I would hope SAF_Zoom would kindly be less frequent with his postings (over 2.5 per day) and his voice would be louder, but that clearly is not the case.

 

Against better advise (from several builders with experience and pictures to prove it) he continues to start threads that are advanced and require major modifications and money. Small modifications impact every aspect of the build; that is why I abanoned making the fuselage several inches wider (a fairly simple mod, but it impacts almost every future step of the build). I have learned that if I build a second aircraft from the plans all the changes required.

 

Mark Twain (again) "There are basically two types of people. People who accomplish things, and people who claim to have accomplished things. The first group is less crowded."

 

I am building and have completed Chapters 4,5,6,7,8,9 & 14. I am currently working on Chapter 10 & 11. I have purchased an O-320 D3G and have it sitting in the hanger. I have submitted several drawings for full sized parts the Terf-CD does not provide when printed on standard sized paper. Pointed out the lack of a correct size cut-out in Chapter 7 for the Canard cutout due to resizing during printing.

 

My advise to SAF_Zoom is based on my one year of experience building from the Terf-CD and Open EZ templates you seem reluctant to purcahse even though you admit they are "insignificant". In my humble opinion, it will be much cheaper for you to purchase a half completed project. There is one on ebay listed now, but so is the Terf-CD (for under $200 (US)).

 

The modifications will require a set of plans for a baseline to make changes. Against better advise SAF_Zoom continues posting "Crazy" ideas and has only purchased a membership in CSA (A good thing in my opinion). But I continue to be amazed by the number of postings show up in threads for a newbie that clearly hasn't done (and most likely will never do) anything.

 

I welcome productive questions from everybody, but recommend SAF_Zoom continue to find the 20+ builders that he has proposed build his airplane. I for one would gladly vote his postings off the island and put his TIKI tourch out with no immunity.

 

For the members that are building the risk of SAF_Zoom being taken as a legitimate source of anything risks a legitimate builders projects and lives.

 

Mark Twain (yet again) "Better to be silent and thought a fool, than to open your mouth and remove all doubt."

 

SAF_Zoom continues to remove any doubt.

 

Respectfully submitted;

 

Jeff

[Vacabrava]

...Against better advise (from several builders with experience and pictures to prove it) he continues to start threads that are advanced and require major modifications and money. Small modifications impact every aspect of the build; that is why I abanoned making the fuselage several inches wider (a fairly simple mod, but it impacts almost every future step of the build). I have learned that if I build a second aircraft from the plans all the changes required.

 

Mark Twain (again) "There are basically two types of people. People who accomplish things, and people who claim to have accomplished things. The first group is less crowded."

 

...

The modifications will require a set of plans for a baseline to make changes. Against better advise SAF_Zoom continues posting "Crazy" ideas and has only purchased a membership in CSA (A good thing in my opinion). But I continue to be amazed by the number of postings show up in threads for a newbie that clearly hasn't done (and most likely will never do) anything.

 

I welcome productive questions from everybody, but recommend SAF_Zoom continue to find the 20+ builders that he has proposed build his airplane. I for one would gladly vote his postings off the island and put his TIKI tourch out with no immunity.

 

...

Hey Jeff,

I am with you. Yesterday I posted one new thread, here are,

http://www.canardzone.com/forum/showthread.php?t=8466

I did not have any answers, as here we discussed the sex of angels.

And good builders and flyers also responded to this topic.

I ask you all: this forum is for discussing canard okay? I do not understand how I bring a good thing that is a retractable that fits into a Cozy but can fit one LEz, that any builder can construct, and do not even get a reply?

The figures are wrong. There is little focus on important things and relegate to good ideas.

Sincerity,

[Cozy Girrrl]

Guys, guys , guys... this is a common phenomina, so common that maybe there should be a required statement to read as a condition of joining a forum like this...

Motivated Newbee joins forum, excited about the possibilities, Newbee reads all the posts then makes a post of his own, usually an introduction and his wishlist of all the mods he is going to make to his new better version of the plane. That much is predictable and we see it over and over again.

To a Newbee dreamer, all things are possible; it is a fantasy world.

To the builder that is four or more years of honest building into their project, they know better, they also have learned from the experiences of others and have absorbed a lot of the community knowledge.

The canard aircraft is not a boat; you cannot just do anything you want to it and as long as it still floats you have been successful. If for some reason it does not meet your requirements, then it is not the right plane for your mission. If my butt gets any bigger I'll need to buy a Bonanza, not widen the fuselage.

Over and over we get new people who come in and get the whole group all spooled up with theoretical nonsense they picked up elsewhere rather than the practical every day concerns about how to build a canard aircraft or even dare say how to build a better canard aircraft. Yes, that does include modifications but incrimentally, within reality not "I want to widen it 14" so I can get up and go down the aisle to use the powder room" ...may as well put a cocktail service cart back there while you are at it.

Newbees, I am not being mean spirited and I used to be the first to jump on Nat Puffer for his usual comeback about Newbees being "First time builders who have never flown before" it sounded like something unpleasant on the bottom of his shoe. Our whole attitude about building and modifying these planes has changed over the time we have been building our plane. Now that it is nearly finished we can look back and speak from a little bit of experience that there are a few things we do encourage people to do if they want to take them on but for the most part..

 

Build it to the plans, put a Lycoming in it and you will have the coolest plane on any ramp anywhere you go, period.

 

Change it and modify it and you will have a project forever that will probably become a broken dream, lawn art or another failed project to add to your list of non-accomplishments.

 

This group like many others is here to help you succeed, we can only do so if you are building the same aircraft the rest of us are building. Not that we are not interested or indifferent to your ideas, it is just that we see this over and over again. Newbee comes in, is all ideas, does not even own plans yet and wants to change the world, gets disgruntled when they get a "helpful response" like this one and goes away saying those people over on the Canard Zone are purists who are trying to suppress creativity.

 

Its frustrating. Some creative people don't have a thick skin and get tired of what they think is being treated poorly so they go off and build in a vacuum. The ones who finish their projects and somehow get them certificated are lucky if they survive their first few hours. We read about them every couple of years.

So please, stick around, we're an okay bunch of people and really do have your best interests at heart.

We really want to do everything we can to encourage you to build, to succeed and to be safe.

 

...Chrissi

[Waiter]

Yah, Everything Chrissi said!

 

Waiter

[Edge 513]

Yessss. What Chrissi said...

...for several years now.

Definitely the 'modification mentality' occurs because these are plans build planes. You wont find this happening at a Vans group. Also please note they are completing like one every other day now..due to the predrilled/prefab nature. No head scratching, noodling, figure things out for a month or two whilst building and tossing, and then refabricating some more. Following the Cozy/OpenEZ plans with only minor changes nets a groovy airplane at the end.

Undoubtedly as has been said, the "coolest airplane on the ramp".

 

What are minor changes? Ruminate and illuminate.