Kit Plane for Sale

[GB Bailey]

I have no plans and do not know the manufacturer. Kit includes everything except the engine and avionics.

Please see attached pictures.

Would appreciate any help in identifying this UUFO (Un-identifed Un-Flying Object). Entertaining reasonable offers.

Thank You.

[Waiter]

Darn, I got some pictures exactly like these

Are you buying or selling??

Waiter

[CFernandez]

Would appreciate any help in identifying this UUFO (Un-identifed Un-Flying Object). Entertaining reasonable offers.

Looks like a Varieze or Longeze fuselage. Someone more informed might be able to tell you the difference. Why are you selling?

[Waiter]

As soon as he answers my question, I'll describe more detail in those two photos then he would ever care to know!

Waiter

[adouglas]

Waiter, you're torturing us. What are you talking about? Is this your airplane, or something? Is this a joke? Is this a troll?

[Waiter]

OK, OK, But he still better tell me if he's buying or selling!

Every EZ builder in the world has photos exactly like these.

 

Its a strictly plans built LongEZ.

Its currently in long term storage

The workmanship looks good (as best I can tell from the photo)

It has a Brock nose extension system with spring.

It has rear mounted brakes and cylinders

The rudder cable system is installed, so the rudders pedals may be installed

It is set up for an O-235 engine, but the mount is not installed

The Center Spar has been attached

The Center spar wing bolts have NOT been drilled.

The instrument panel has not been cut out yet

It has standard Cleveland brakes.

It has standard LongEZ nose and main wheel tires (5x500)

It has the Nose wheel swivel cover installed.

It does not have nose gear doors

The Boarding step is installed, but doesn't have a tie down hole drilled.

The Canopy has NOT been fitted yet

Wheel pant mounts are installed, but wheel pants are not shown

Standard fuel sites

Currently set up for Scoop cooling (but can still be changed at this point)

Seat belt attach fillings are installed both front and rear

 

It is October 2nd 2002, and he got one of his buddies to help him move it out of the storage for photos.

 

From here, I'll guess;

The photo was taken in the late afternoon (7pm), and its about 75 Degrees outside. (shadows, color scale, person wearing light clothing)

 

OK, I dun my part, Now, Are you Buying or selling???

Waiter

[adouglas]

Okay, that answers all of that...thanks!

The big problem, of course, is NO PLANS. So...no templates, no way to build the airfoils...big bummerino.

Hmmm...would it be possible to bypass that little problem with cores from Featherlite and a TERF CD????

[adouglas]

GB....

Since according to your post you don't know anything about it, then obviously you didn't build it.

So...what's your interest/involvement in it?

Thanks....

[Len Evansic]

adouglas said:

Hmmm...would it be possible to bypass that little problem with cores from Featherlite and a TERF CD????

What's a TERF CD?

-- Len

[SULLY_H60]

I am interested but unsure how one would proceed? Would you buy another set of plans and start from that with completing the build and certification? I am new to this stuff and have recently jump started an old interest in buying/building an EZ. Thanks

[Waiter]

Theres still way to many questions about this particular plane, but the person who originally posted must not be interested in selling, as I've made numerous attempts to contact him. but no returns.

This could be a good jumpstart on a project, but as Sully observed, you'll probably need to purchase a set of plans from somewhere before this particular project could proceed.

TERF CD - This is the company that digitized all the Rutan plans and drawings. The CD goes for several hunderd dollars.

Waiter

[adouglas]

SULLY_H60 said:

I am interested but unsure how one would proceed? Would you buy another set of plans and start from that with completing the build and certification? I am new to this stuff and have recently jump started an old interest in buying/building an EZ. Thanks

Well, given that Long EZ plans were pulled of the market eons ago and there are VERY VERY few sets with templates out there, it would be tough to come up with the appropriate stuff.

Plus there's the whole ethical license agreement issue. You can't legally use a set of plans that has been used to build another airplane. A set of plans that has not been used or registered (are there any?) presents a whole new problem, since Rutan is out of business. Just how would one legally build an airplane from a virgin set of plans if it's impossible to register them?

Legalities aside, the TERF CD does have the manual portion of the LongEZ plans in PDF format, but no templates, so you can't build a whole airplane from it.

Without templates, you can't cut the airfoils, strake bulkheads, etc....

I too have tried several times to reach this guy. Go figure.

Waiter: Back off, man, you already have an airplane!

Sully: Dibs. I saw it first.

[SULLY_H60]

All makes sense...I was wondering how to pull it off if the workmanship is vg. It would be possible to buy a dinged EZ and use this as a great platform to start with legit paperwork for a rebuild of the plane. Seems like so many other ads the bait is on the hook but the fisherman has gone away. Thanks waiter for the heads up...nice webpage and nice EZ! adouglas thanks as well and I copied all on the first dibs...you are number one in the pattern Thanks again.

[Jon Matcho]

levansic said:

What's a TERF CD?

You heard of Nerf®, right? Well this is Terf.

The TERF CD (not sure what T-E-R-F stands for) can be purchased here: http://www.dragonaero.com/RAFCDROM.htm

Everyone, consider this hypothetical scenario:

1. Buy a TERF CD for Long-EZ plans.
2. Acquire used (or good copies of) Long-EZ templates.
3. Build a 100% per-plans Long-EZ.
4. Present the plane to the FAA DAR as a "per-plans Long-EZ" for inpsection.
5. Register it with the FAA as "{your last name} + Canard".

Results:

• The FAA will NOT care that you do not have a RAF registration number as it's not a criteria for air worthiness.
• Burt Rutan will NOT care (or even know about you) as long as you do NOT refer to the plane as a Long-EZ (or anything EZ, Eze, etc.).
• Assuming the regular procedure, you will receive an N-number and will be flying.

I'm not advocating or recommending this at all; just pointing out reality.

[adouglas]

True, true... but...

2) Acquire used (or good copies of) Long-EZ templates.

Just exactly where does one acquire these from, pray tell?

AFAIK, this is the BIG sticking point for those of us who still want to build Long EZes.

The only remaining option is the Cozy Mk IV. While a fine airplane, some of us simply don't need a four-place aircraft.

If I had my druthers, I'd go for a smaller, lighter, more fuel-efficient two-place...a Long EZ.

Dang it, I really wish I'd bought plans way back when.

BTW, Jon, I PMed you on this issue several days ago...please email me...adouglas (at) optonline (dot) net

Thanks

[Jon Matcho]

adouglas said:

Just exactly where does one acquire these from, pray tell?

You have to search. I've seen them become available via:

• www.ebay.com
• www.barnstormers.com
• http://www.condorsales.com
• this forum
• mailing list discussions
• ask to "borrow" from someone who has built

I was able to acquire good copies of Long-EZ templates, but they're currently out on loan (sorry, not for sale). My point is, you can find them now and again.

Just add a little more cowbell and all will be good.

[Gray-Eagle]

What is the location of this project?

[adouglas]

I did get one email from the guy. It's near Seattle.

Repeated emails and PMs have not resulted in any response whatsoever.

[GB Bailey]

Re: Kit Plane for Sale - Updated Information

 

Thanks to Waiter for his identification of my UUFO - it is no longer a UUFO. From the pictures included in my original post, the following is what Waiter has identified:

- Its a strictly plans built LongEZ

- Its currently in long term storage

- The workmanship looks good (as best I can tell from the photo)

- It has a Brock nose extension system with spring

- It has rear mounted brakes and cylinders

- The rudder cable system is installed, so the rudders pedals may be installed

- It is set up for an O-235 engine, but the mount is not installed

- The center spar has been attached

- The Center spar wing bolts have NOT been drilled

- The instrument panel has not been cut out yet

- It has standard Cleveland brakes

- It has standard LongEZ nose and main wheel tires (5x500)

- It has the Nose wheel cover installed

- It does not have nose gear doors

- The Boarding step is installed, but doesn't have a tie down hole drilled

- The Canopy has NOT been fitted yet

- Wheel pant mounts are installed, but wheel pants are not shown

- Standard fuel sites

- Currently set up for Scoop cooling (but can still be changed at this point)

- Seat belt attach fillings are installed both front and rear

 

Other items not previously mentioned:

- 18 blocks of blue building foam

- 2 rolls of fiber cloth

- Plus numerous other items

 

Although this was not my undertaking, I would like to see someone complete the project and enjoy flying it.

It's located in Bremerton, WA and I am entertaining reasonable cash offers (so that would mean I am selling).

Thanks again, Waiter, for your input.

New photos are attached.

[adouglas]

With all due respect, there still isn't enough information here to make an intelligent offer.

General statements like "numerous other items" don't tell us anything we actually need to know. Wings? What about the canard? Are the winglets complete and attached? Instruments?

You said you don't have the plans, but the most recent photo is of the canard and elevator templates...which are part of the plans. So are the plans there or aren't they?

Is there ANY documentation (such as a builder's log or photos)?

This looks like a nice project and it would be great to see it get a home. But if you want to sell it, you really do need to give us more information. Here's exactly why:

1) The plans include critical information that is REQUIRED to complete the project, such as incidence templates, which is not available from any other source. Without those, you can't mount the wings or canard correctly, and without that, the project goes nowhere. So we have a statement that you don't have plans, but a photo that suggests you do. Which is it, please?

2) Without any other documentation such as a builder's log or construction photos, a hard-nosed DAR or FAA type might not allow the purchaser to certify it as "experimental, amateur-built" because there is no evidence that it was not built by a professional, for profit. The law says that at least 51% of the airplane must have been built for "education and recreation." This is proved by taking pictures and notes during construction.

Please...I'm not trying to give you a hard time here, just trying to find out if it's worth pursuing this. For me, probably not since I live in New England and renting a truck to get it home would cost a heck of a lot. But somebody out on the left coast will undoubtedly be very interested in it.

Please answer our questions and reply to our communications. The last email I sent to you was over three weeks ago, and I never got a response. Others on this thread have reported similar experiences.

[Randy]

Hey Waiter,

Since you know so much about this particular fuse. then you might have a clue as to the craftsmanship. I've looked at alot of ez projects and wouldn't fly my dog in them when completed. Craftsmanship is the key to buying a used aircraft but there isn't alot of them that are built safely. Its sort of a buyer beware. I build aircraft for a living here in Wichita, KS and see it everyday in the real world of aircraft construction so whats to say that this fuse is good enough to be called an aircraft part and not a look alike. I also have a set of plans but no templates. Same ole story loaned them out and they never returned. I would also like to have a set of templates for the airfoils and am planning on finishing my project in the near future when I get some of the immediate projects finished. Anyone need a Q-1 fuse???????

Randy

[Randy]

Hey you might want to reconsider selling someone else's projects. You have to have a set of plans to accompany the fuse or the project drastically reduces on value and can only be used as an aircraft part and not a full fledged project. Don't know if you're on the up and up but when you sell a partially completed homebuilt you assume the responsibility about the quality of the craftsmanship and are putting yourself in a seriously precarius legal situation between you and the buyer even though the future owner signs a waiver releasing you from any liability, the family can come back on you in the even the future builder becomes hurt or killed in attempting to fly this project. Better watch out!!!!!!

Randy

[mwilli7119]

Did this project ever sell??

[H.Zwakenberg]

since I own the TERF CD's, I too would like to learn where/how to get those templates everyone is alluding to....

bye

Hans

[dpaton]

H.Zwakenberg said:

since I own the TERF CD's, I too would like to learn where/how to get those templates everyone is alluding to....

Hans, the best way to get them is to search constantly, ask regularly, and be very very patient. I've been looking for a set for about 6 months now. I refuse to pay thr skyrocketing sums for a full plans set, so I'm biding my time until a set of templates appear under my nose. It's a long process, but it seems to be a tried and true one.

-dave