Don Woodward Posted January 1, 2005 Share Posted January 1, 2005 Dear All There have been small single seat canard design aircraft like the Quicky. but i have never seen a single seat canard design that is like the Long-EZ or Cozy. So hear is my Design Brife for one Single seat canard design like Long-Ez fast build Powered by 503 Rotax Pilot weight to 110kg Fast Good visability I would like to hear other peoples thoughts on it. My thoughts are that it may get builders to build composit canard aircraft. I am not an aircraft engineer so do not feel i could design my self. Quote Standard Cozy IV builder only 2 mods, because I want to get into the air fast. At CH7 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EzYoYo Posted January 3, 2005 Share Posted January 3, 2005 If you check out the following address, you will find that what you are talking about has been flying around for quite some time: http://www.experimental.ch/SwissMade/Gion_Bezzola/gb-3.htm Sport Aviation had an article on the GB-2 Retro in February 1982. Gion Bezzola has gone on to design and build one more single place canard called the GB-3 Vetro. He does not sell plans. It appears that he has used the VariEze building methods and powers the pusher with a VW engine. EzYoYo Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
karoliina Posted January 3, 2005 Share Posted January 3, 2005 Hi, I would not recommend using Rotax 503 in any design. The four stroke version 912 UL weights more but is zillion times more reliable and has 80 hp power and 1500 hour rebuild-cycle. My former flight instructor has some experience on the two stroke Rotax engines in regards of european microlights. He have done about 20 forced landings with the old two-stroke microlights and none with the newer stuff which is analoguous to USA SportsPlane category except that there is no upper limit for speed unlike in USA, can be as fast as possible as long as the stall speed can be done with high lift flaps or some other way down to 65 km/h or below. One of our flight clubs flight instructors was giving a presentation what they did with ultralights (in some other countries called microlights) in 1980s. They fixed the engine in the morning and for the end of the day they did a forced langing or two. They measured a mean catastrophic failure rate for the two stroke engine that 1 start per 50 starts at least will lead to forced landing. With one person canard equipped with two stroke Rotax, you can get yourself killed in less than 50 hours in other words (if you don't succeed in the forced landing and walk away alive). Where you need the single seater as the two seater RMT Bateleur would do the task nicely and billion times more safely, wouldn't it? http://www.rmtaviation.com Equipped with either Rotax 912ULS (100 hp) or Rotax 914 turbo (115 hp), the aircraft has exceptional performance in the ultralight/microlight/SportsPlane (choose your term depending on country) category. I thought that RMT Aviation would be out of the business because their e-mail bounced back, but the trick was to resend the question and on the second try it did work. They are offering a info-DVD for 10 EUR. I am going to order it. The specs for Bateleur are great. - 450/472.5 kg (EU) MTOW (without/with BRS) - Stall speed below 65 km/h - Cruise speed 270 km/h IAS with turbo Rotax - Fuel consumption, autogas 12-14 liters per hour. Miles per gallon ratio unbeatable. You can fly really fast with a minimum amount of gas. Bateleur is available as a quick build kit as well (in addition to being sold as a complete aircraft). Its price tag is rather high, but carbon fiber + microlight + canard is an equation where the result is not cheap. One could build a fast build Velocity with the same price or less. Look at the canard incidence by the way: Interesting design, isn't it? Best Regards, Karoliina Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Don Woodward Posted January 3, 2005 Author Share Posted January 3, 2005 Hi karoliina's Thank you for that As for the Rotax 503 and other 2 stroke rotaxes, it is cheep engine and reliable if you manage it. I have many flight houres with them, Good engine managment is needed with 2 stroke engines I was thinking of a cheap,fastbuild kit. ill look into it after doing my cozy4 Quote Standard Cozy IV builder only 2 mods, because I want to get into the air fast. At CH7 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
karoliina Posted January 3, 2005 Share Posted January 3, 2005 Hi, It was explained some time ago here why two stroke engines are not suitable for aircraft use. I don't remember exactly what was the reason, but the two stroke engines weren't suitable for traffic pattern like use. It has something to do with RPM and the oil lubrication which was lost in certain conditions in a traffic pattern no matter how well and carefully the engine would have been serviced and managed. Despite of maintenance, they are generally considered unreliable here. Quite much all of those who have flown those early day ultralights (microlights) with two stroke Rotax engines, have done at least dozen forced landings. It just isn't very good figure. That is why even class A ultralights, in other words the Trikes are mainly equipped nowadays with four stroke engines and no-one wants to get into a plane equipped with a two stroke engine. Br, Karoliina Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mika Heinonen Posted January 3, 2005 Share Posted January 3, 2005 Heh, that looks really like an interesting design Karoliina, if I was mean I would say they had some problem with the balance point How's the good old Vari-Ez doing though, it's a single seater, and in my opinion the most beautiful design of an airplane I have ever seen. It's the harmony in perfection. Another canard airplane I really admire is the Lockspeiser LDA-01, it's square, but it has the "something". I don't like the newer layouts though with the single front wheel constellation, it had it's charm at best with the 4 wheel design. Also a one-seater, and you can bring your luggage too. It's the cow of the skies Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Don Woodward Posted January 4, 2005 Author Share Posted January 4, 2005 I think sombody placed the canard in the wrong place Quote Standard Cozy IV builder only 2 mods, because I want to get into the air fast. At CH7 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
karoliina Posted January 4, 2005 Share Posted January 4, 2005 I am not sure if it is in a wrong place. I assume that it has something to do with its very slow stall speed of 65 km/h. If you look the side picture what it reminds the most? To me it looks distantly like giant fowler flaps. Unlike other canards, Bateleur is STOL (short takeoff and landing) aircraft and can be operated from unimproved airfields unlike other canards. It is still very fast to be a microlight (or Finnish term class B ultralight) and it is also lightweight if compared to other alternatives such as TL-96 Star which is near to the upper limit of the allowable weight in Finland. Because I am not rich, in the mean time (before a plans built canard project of any kind can be finished as it takes formiddably long time), here is a picture of the bird I am thinking of buying now: (One of the alternatives) Another pic No near a canard performance, but ok in the meantime. Specs: - 180 km/h IAS (cruise), about 200 km/h IAS max (realistic) level speed (I have tried and it does not go faster), but goes easily 250 km/h in dive - Vne 275 km/h - Empty weight 285 kg including instruments - Full composite structure - +4/-2 G - Rotax 912 UL 80 hp - Stall speed without flaps 80 km/h - Stall speed with full flaps 65 km/h - Does not enter spins easily and stalls softly - High glide ratio - Two place with dual controls. - Fixed pitch three blade carbon fiber propeller Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Don Woodward Posted January 4, 2005 Author Share Posted January 4, 2005 Hi You can not put that plane on this forum its a normal plane. It also has the canard in the wrong place ha ha. It must be very cold in Finland now. It was when i was in Helsiky many years ago at this time. Get a canard plane as they fly better i feel than normail plans. Well i think im just going to carry on building my Cozy 4 and leard from the costruction prosess. Have a look at this http://qmain.tripod.com/raptor.htm Quote Standard Cozy IV builder only 2 mods, because I want to get into the air fast. At CH7 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kumaros Posted January 4, 2005 Share Posted January 4, 2005 I am not sure if it is in a wrong place. I assume that it hassomething to do with its very slow stall speed of 65 km/h. If you look the side picture what it reminds the most? To me it looks distantly like giant fowler flaps. Unlike other canards, Bateleur is STOL (short takeoff and landing) aircraft and can be operated from unimproved airfields unlike other canards. It is still very fast to be a microlight (or Finnish term class B ultralight) and it is also lightweight if compared to other alternatives such as TL-96 Star which is near to the upper limit of the allowable weight in Finland. Hi Karoliina, I wish you a happy and prosperous New year. The Bateleur aircraft is very interesting. I remember coming upon it on the internet some years ago, when operations were still based in South Africa. Your recent post in another thread renewed my interest and I went to the new German site. Then I ordered a back issue of Flieger Magazin (January 2002) to find out more, and now I have mixed feelings about this aircraft. The gist of it is: On the positive side: - Strong, light construction - Reliable 4-stroke, Rotax power - STOL, capable of operating from unimproved fields - Quick to build from a kit On the negative side: - It is supposed to be a derivative of the Delta Dart, the prototype of which crashed, killing the designer - Very expensive for my pocket, more than EUR 68.000 ex VAT at 2002 prices Anyway, the ideal aircraft for me would be a blend of one of the Rutan designs with IBIS and Bateleur and Range-R. This means canard, STOL, diesel power. Until such an aircraft becomes available, I'll order the Aerocanard plans and start building, planning on fitting a 3 liter V6 turbodiesel. Kumaros It's all Greek to me Quote It's all Greek to me Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Delta-Dart Posted February 6, 2007 Share Posted February 6, 2007 I am not sure if it is in a wrong place. I assume that it has ... The Bateleur aircraft is very interesting. I remember coming upon it on the internet some years ago, when operations were still based in South Africa. Your recent post in another thread renewed my interest and I went to the new German site. Then I ordered a back issue of Flieger Magazin (January 2002) to find out more, and now I have mixed feelings about this aircraft. The gist of it is: On the positive side: - Strong, light construction - Reliable 4-stroke, Rotax power - STOL, capable of operating from unimproved fields - Quick to build from a kit On the negative side: - It is supposed to be a derivative of the Delta Dart, the prototype of which crashed, killing the designer - Very expensive for my pocket, more than EUR 68.000 ex VAT at 2002 prices ... Hello all, here is the original Delta-Dart from liquidation after the death of the owner. http://www.canardzone.com/forum/showthread.php?t=2125 The Plane, all plans and datasheets, negative forms and the rights to do with what you want. If somebody is interestet to start bussines with building airplanes ... Let me now Regards Mike Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Craig Jones Posted February 8, 2007 Share Posted February 8, 2007 Hi all. I hear ya, we need more designers like Rutan, I have been a big fan of his aircraft for many years, I was lucky enough to purchased a 2nd hand Quickie 1 at a very cheap price, it has a 503 rotax and flies like a dream. I don't have a lot of hours under my belt but was keen maybe a little crazy to get behind the controls and was amazed how eazy it was to fly, it's everything I dreamed in my aircraft, fast, cheap, eazy to fly. I think people are a bit put off by unconventional designed aircraft, the quickie revamped into a cheap kit would be great for the recreational aviation market, I would buy another one. Craig Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
raiki Posted February 8, 2007 Share Posted February 8, 2007 Craig Have you got Gordons old Quickie from the York Peninsula ???? Quote Adrian Smart Cozy IV #1453 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Craig Jones Posted February 8, 2007 Share Posted February 8, 2007 Hi Raiki. Yep, thats the one.!! Found it sitting in a farm shed in kapunda gathering dust, it had not flown in 6 years after Gordon died, the son had it. The paint is in need of some TLC but the rest is in good condition, the engine has only done 150 hours and started almost first pull after six years, I can't wait to fly it this weekend. :D Hows your project going.???? Regards Craig Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
raiki Posted February 9, 2007 Share Posted February 9, 2007 My project, as in the Cozy, is not started yet. I have the plans, but am still working on a canard construction facility. Quote Adrian Smart Cozy IV #1453 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thjakits Posted February 24, 2007 Share Posted February 24, 2007 How about a Vari-Eze: Recline seat to 37º Move engine forward if you can, reinforce engine-mount if using a monsterengine (Mazda Rotary 2-rotor, turbo, and whatever you like) which you can do now that there is no pax retracts, pax weight differently invested If you can't move the engine, use the rear seat space for fuel and luggage Have some pro work the plan, maybe you can push Vne. Still, make the cockpit a little wider - so you can scratch the outside of your upper arm - normally squeezed into the Vari-eze ) Single seater plus: You don't have to give rides!!! ) Single seater minus: You can't give rides!!! If you are not stuck with a canard, consider a BD-5 or a Taylor Mini-IMP Best Regards, Thomas, dreaming about BD-4 with mods.... ......lately drooling over canards like: http://www.ez.org/feature/F0502-1/F0502-1.htm .......more drooling over a slightly modified Polen Special .....most drooling over: http://www.wingco.com/ Blended Wing Body / Flying Wing and imagine single seat versions of it!! ) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andre Posted June 7, 2008 Share Posted June 7, 2008 Hi, It was explained some time ago here why two stroke engines are not suitable for aircraft use. I don't remember exactly what was the reason, but the two stroke engines weren't suitable for traffic pattern like use. It has something to do with RPM and the oil lubrication which was lost in certain conditions in a traffic pattern no matter how well and carefully the engine would have been serviced and managed. Despite of maintenance, they are generally considered unreliable here. Quite much all of those who have flown those early day ultralights (microlights) with two stroke Rotax engines, have done at least dozen forced landings. It just isn't very good figure. That is why even class A ultralights, in other words the Trikes are mainly equipped nowadays with four stroke engines and no-one wants to get into a plane equipped with a two stroke engine. Br, Karoliina Hi Karolina. I love what you have to say about my Bateleur, I think you soon deserve shares in the company. Go and check out our new website. Do you have Skype? Kind regards Andre RMT Aviation. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZUCZZ Posted June 7, 2008 Share Posted June 7, 2008 You people have a tar runway at Howick? Quote I live in my own little world! but its OK, they know me here! Chris Van Hoof, Johannesburg, South Africa operate from FASY (Baragwanath) Cozy Mk IV, ZU-CZZ, IO-360 (200hp) 70x80 prop Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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